Form 1 solvent traps?

1969honda

Well-Known Member
Supporting Member
Location
Cache
Email Jake with your questions/concerns, he'll respond. He was in the Utah Army National Guard for a few years as part of the 19th Special Forces Group performing Senior Armorer NCOIC duties, as well as Idaho Army NG. He's a very helpful and intelligent armorer. His designs won Shot Show a couple years ago in the 7.62 category for Gemtec before he struck out on his own.
 

Kevin B.

Big hippy
Moderator
Location
Vehicular limbo
Email Jake with your questions/concerns, he'll respond. He was in the Utah Army National Guard for a few years as part of the 19th Special Forces Group performing Senior Armorer NCOIC duties, as well as Idaho Army NG. He's a very helpful and intelligent armorer. His designs won Shot Show a couple years ago in the 7.62 category for Gemtec before he struck out on his own.
Jake as in the guy at JK Armament? The disclaimer on his web page made me think he wouldn't talk at all about any other use for his "solvent trap". If that's not the case I'll definitely hit him up, thanks!
 

Herzog

somewhat damaged
Admin
Location
Wyoming
Jake as in the guy at JK Armament? The disclaimer on his web page made me think he wouldn't talk at all about any other use for his "solvent trap". If that's not the case I'll definitely hit him up, thanks!
They are very forward about the fact that modifying their product requires a Form 1. I don't think they'd hesitate about talking with you.
 

1969honda

Well-Known Member
Supporting Member
Location
Cache
Yes, Jake as in the owner of JK Armament. He's very down to earth and easy to talk with.
 

NYCEGUY01

Well-Known Member
Location
Willard, UT
A can is kind of a waste on 5.56 in general. Even the good ones.
Not sure if you’re well versed but even a good can doesn’t make an AR hearing safe IMO.
I still shoot the 556 with earplugs, the 308 as well unless I’m shooting subsonic.

22, 300 blk, and 45 are the fun ones. ( .308 subsonic loads too).
 

DAA

Well-Known Member
An AR without a can is a waste.

So it's still not hearing safe. It's still WAY nicer to shoot or be around when suppressed. I won't use an AR without a suppressor. They're just too obnoxious without one. I especially hate having one to the side of me at a shooting range. I just pack up and leave when an un-suppressed AR shows up at the next bench. Even with molded plugs and muffs over the ear, they're still obnoxious. A suppressed AR with just one form of earpro or the other is a hoot to shoot.

Can say the same for my 6-284. No fun to shoot without a can, even with earpro, mucho fun with a can. Now that I think about it, since I cut my .20-250 to 19", I'd never want to shoot it ever again without a can, even with doubled up earpro. Neither one is anywhere near hearing safe with the can, but they are downright pleasant to shoot. When I thump a coyote with the .20-250 the meat report is louder than the muzzle blast.

Actually, I never want to shoot anything without a can anymore. Most of my barrels that aren't threaded gather dust.

And I won't hunt with earplugs, either.

I've never seen a real Form 1 type solvent trap in use though. Just the totally illegal kind. I would hope the real one from a purpose built kit works a lot better than the home brews I've seen in use. None of them suppressed very well. The comment about not being ideal for a short barrel or .300 makes me think it's not full auto rated either, which might not be ideal on an AR. I like a full auto rated can on the AR. Just because my daughter likes to do mag dumps and even the full auto can starts to smoke after a couple in a row.

- DAA
 

mbryson

.......a few dollars more
Supporting Member
An AR without a can is a waste.

So it's still not hearing safe. It's still WAY nicer to shoot or be around when suppressed. I won't use an AR without a suppressor. They're just too obnoxious without one. I especially hate having one to the side of me at a shooting range. I just pack up and leave when an un-suppressed AR shows up at the next bench. Even with molded plugs and muffs over the ear, they're still obnoxious. A suppressed AR with just one form of earpro or the other is a hoot to shoot.

Can say the same for my 6-284. No fun to shoot without a can, even with earpro, mucho fun with a can. Now that I think about it, since I cut my .20-250 to 19", I'd never want to shoot it ever again without a can, even with doubled up earpro. Neither one is anywhere near hearing safe with the can, but they are downright pleasant to shoot. When I thump a coyote with the .20-250 the meat report is louder than the muzzle blast.

Actually, I never want to shoot anything without a can anymore. Most of my barrels that aren't threaded gather dust.

And I won't hunt with earplugs, either.

I've never seen a real Form 1 type solvent trap in use though. Just the totally illegal kind. I would hope the real one from a purpose built kit works a lot better than the home brews I've seen in use. None of them suppressed very well. The comment about not being ideal for a short barrel or .300 makes me think it's not full auto rated either, which might not be ideal on an AR. I like a full auto rated can on the AR. Just because my daughter likes to do mag dumps and even the full auto can starts to smoke after a couple in a row.

- DAA


Strangely timed thread as I've been looking a bit at these of late. I'm sure these are likely still a year or more out as far as the permitting process?

https://silencerco.com/silencers/chimera-300/ is what I've been perusing but I'm not sure what the advantages/disadvantages are to various models. This bothers me as well
*We do not recommend shooting lead projectiles out of any of our sealed suppressors.
Why the hell would I want one if I can't shoot lead projectiles?

https://silencerco.com/silencers/harvester-evo doesn't have that disclaimer so maybe that's what I'm after?

 

DAA

Well-Known Member
https://silencerco.com/silencers/chimera-300/ is what I've been perusing but I'm not sure what the advantages/disadvantages are to various models. This bothers me as well Why the hell would I want one if I can't shoot lead projectiles?

I "think" they mean non jacketed lead bullets. Lead bullets without jackets tend to fill up a can with crud pretty quick. And since you can't take it apart to clean it, getting the crud out is difficult at best. Or you end up using chemical methods that are dangerous. That's why most rimfire specific cans are take down, so you can get them apart to scrape the crud out.

I think the Omega is quieter than the Chimera? Definitely lighter. The only reason I can see for the Chimera is if you intend to abuse it, and in that case, it fits the bill. For the vast majority of people and applications I think the lighter, quieter Omega is a better choice. The Harvester is a very old design, very robust, very heavy, not as quiet as newer designs like the Omega. But it's a really good value and still very popular.

If you are considering SiCo money, you should look into TBAC too. I think they are better made and more effective. About the most expensive option out there too though. But they are nice. I run TBAC Ultra 7 on my bolt guns and swap the one can around. Got an Omega because I got a killer deal on one and just to put on an AR and leave it there forever.

- DAA
 

NYCEGUY01

Well-Known Member
Location
Willard, UT
An AR without a can is a waste.

So it's still not hearing safe. It's still WAY nicer to shoot or be around when suppressed. I won't use an AR without a suppressor. They're just too obnoxious without one. I especially hate having one to the side of me at a shooting range. I just pack up and leave when an un-suppressed AR shows up at the next bench. Even with molded plugs and muffs over the ear, they're still obnoxious. A suppressed AR with just one form of earpro or the other is a hoot to shoot.

Can say the same for my 6-284. No fun to shoot without a can, even with earpro, mucho fun with a can. Now that I think about it, since I cut my .20-250 to 19", I'd never want to shoot it ever again without a can, even with doubled up earpro. Neither one is anywhere near hearing safe with the can, but they are downright pleasant to shoot. When I thump a coyote with the .20-250 the meat report is louder than the muzzle blast.

Actually, I never want to shoot anything without a can anymore. Most of my barrels that aren't threaded gather dust.

And I won't hunt with earplugs, either.

I've never seen a real Form 1 type solvent trap in use though. Just the totally illegal kind. I would hope the real one from a purpose built kit works a lot better than the home brews I've seen in use. None of them suppressed very well. The comment about not being ideal for a short barrel or .300 makes me think it's not full auto rated either, which might not be ideal on an AR. I like a full auto rated can on the AR. Just because my daughter likes to do mag dumps and even the full auto can starts to smoke after a couple in a row.

- DAA

In general I agree with you completely.
I dont remember the last time I went shooting without a can on everything there.

Most folks dipping in their toes here are super dissapointed with even a good 556 can I guess was my point.
If a guy is gonna have only one or two Id would recommend starting on a caliber it will really work well on.

The comment about full auto rated is dead on. AR's really put a beating on a can for sure. Buy the baddest one you can get and/or afford.
I have a "budget" aluminum baffled 556 can in the safe that if you shake it the baffles rattle because of all the erosion... Im just waiting for it go down range one day...lol I think it was like $100 so... " budget"...lol

I just know, at least for me the .22's and my 1911 are my favorite to shoot suppressed.
All my barrels are short except for one 308 and the 300. If I shoot my 10" 308 without the can it blows my targets and crap off the bench and the two guys next to me get up and leave. LOL
 
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NYCEGUY01

Well-Known Member
Location
Willard, UT
I "think" they mean non jacketed lead bullets. Lead bullets without jackets tend to fill up a can with crud pretty quick. And since you can't take it apart to clean it, getting the crud out is difficult at best. Or you end up using chemical methods that are dangerous. That's why most rimfire specific cans are take down, so you can get them apart to scrape the crud out.

I think the Omega is quieter than the Chimera? Definitely lighter. The only reason I can see for the Chimera is if you intend to abuse it, and in that case, it fits the bill. For the vast majority of people and applications I think the lighter, quieter Omega is a better choice. The Harvester is a very old design, very robust, very heavy, not as quiet as newer designs like the Omega. But it's a really good value and still very popular.

If you are considering SiCo money, you should look into TBAC too. I think they are better made and more effective. About the most expensive option out there too though. But they are nice. I run TBAC Ultra 7 on my bolt guns and swap the one can around. Got an Omega because I got a killer deal on one and just to put on an AR and leave it there forever.

- DAA

Exactly, some guys want to shoot rimfire through a 556 can to got more use out of a single can. Dont do that...

The Omega is pretty dang good. TBAC is very good quality, cant go wrong there. Im a big Dead Air fan. I like the stuff from Rugged as well.

I was Very impressed on a bolt gun with a Scorpion "king" from Lane silencers as well, quiet, Titanium, and under a grand. Cool can.
 
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mbryson

.......a few dollars more
Supporting Member
I "think" they mean non jacketed lead bullets. Lead bullets without jackets tend to fill up a can with crud pretty quick. And since you can't take it apart to clean it, getting the crud out is difficult at best. Or you end up using chemical methods that are dangerous. That's why most rimfire specific cans are take down, so you can get them apart to scrape the crud out.

I think the Omega is quieter than the Chimera? Definitely lighter. The only reason I can see for the Chimera is if you intend to abuse it, and in that case, it fits the bill. For the vast majority of people and applications I think the lighter, quieter Omega is a better choice. The Harvester is a very old design, very robust, very heavy, not as quiet as newer designs like the Omega. But it's a really good value and still very popular.

If you are considering SiCo money, you should look into TBAC too. I think they are better made and more effective. About the most expensive option out there too though. But they are nice. I run TBAC Ultra 7 on my bolt guns and swap the one can around. Got an Omega because I got a killer deal on one and just to put on an AR and leave it there forever.

- DAA


I rarely (never?) mag dump an AR. Good advice as always Dave. Muchos gracias
 

DAA

Well-Known Member
I'd have Dead Air for my rimfires if any had been expected to be available practically ever, when I bought a rimfire can. Went with the killer buddy deal priced, Spectre II instead and it's fine, like you say, .22's or rimfire .17's are so much fun suppressed. My daughter will pull the trigger on the .22/45 all day long if I keep breaking out the ammo.

Never have heard a Dead Air on a centerfire, but I'm sure they're sweet.

I will say, Omega 300 with a .224 cap vs. TBAC Ultra 7 6.5 on the same AR with the same loads, the TBAC sounds quieter. Which, doesn't mean it actually is, but they do sound different.

Not dissing the Omega though, it's a nice piece and the modularity can be a decent plus. Since I don't swap mine around on different barrels, I run it direct thread, for length and weight savings. And it is a pretty short package, for the performance.

- DAA
 

Kevin B.

Big hippy
Moderator
Location
Vehicular limbo
22, 300 blk, and 45 are the fun ones. ( .308 subsonic loads too).
Yeah, this would be going on a 8.5" .300, and I'm aiming less for "hearing safe" and more for "won't utterly destroy my ears if I have to grab it in the middle of the night".

I'll hit up JK and see what they think about that combo of caliber and barrel length.
 

Mouse

Trying to wheel
Supporting Member
Location
West Haven, UT
I've been wanting to look into a can for years, but constantly moving for the military made it impossible....might be time to start looking. Impact arms said they do all the paperwork for you to help sell you the can
 

Herzog

somewhat damaged
Admin
Location
Wyoming
So I looked back into these a couple weeks ago and they are no longer selling the form 1 solvent traps and converted right into Form 3 suppressors. I tried to find out why but it sounds like the form 1's were getting denied for whatever reason. Bummer.

That said, I'm soft looking right now... anybody have experience with Otter Creek Labs?
 

DAA

Well-Known Member
No experience with them, never even heard of them, honestly.

But, just do it. Put a suppresser on. Whether cheap, or expensive. Just do it. You'll immediately start kicking yourself for not doing it sooner.

Screwed my TBAC Ultra 7 on my .17 Mach IV just about an hour ago. Getting ready to splat some varmints next weekend. I chopped it to 18" when I threaded it. A 20 gr. Vmax at 4000 fps from a reasonable length package about as loud as a .22 Mag with zero recoil is more fun to pop varmints with than words can express.

- DAA
 
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