Help me decide on new rig

[StrobeNGH]

Buying a new (to me) SUV. Max budget (cash) is $13k.

Light off-roading and daily driver for now. Want low-range 4wd. Occasional towing, light loads. Seating for 7 would be nice, but isn't a deal breaker. Prefer to get better than 15mpg combined.
I can do a lot of things, but automotive repair is not a skill I've picked up yet, so reliability is important!

We've considered the 4Runner, Lexus GX4---, and Mitsubishi Montero. I want to consider the Xterra, but have had a lot of friends not like theirs...

I've been looking at this listing:
http://www.ksl.com/auto/listing/3332388?ad_cid=6
Seller says top and bottom of the engine have been rebuilt (he thinks it was a head gasket that went at 150k miles that necessitated the "rebuild". Engine ultimately rebuilt by Japanese Engine Exchange in Provo. New exhaust, etc... transmission not rebuilt, suspension is original. It probably needs a new alternator (the double brake lights have been going off), probably a few other things (under $400).

Stay away from it or consider it (I'd have a mechanic look it over if I do)?

Advice/suggestions from more knowledgeable minds is appreciated.

 

[moab_cj5]

I have an 03 Lexus GX470. My vehicle and I didn't get off on the right foot, due to me not doing my due diligence as well as I should have, but it has proven to be quite capable offroad, and comfortable on road since sorting out our early differences. I highly recommend the GX470 if you want a V8 and seating for more than 5. If I did it again, I would look harder for an 05+ with the VVTI engine, but that wouldn't be a deal breaker if I found the right 03 or 04. I get between 13-18 mpg depending on my driving (city, highway, offroad, towing, with my ski rack on top). I think I average 15 mpg mixed, but when I did a 2000+ mile road trip last month I got upwards of 20 mpg strictly freeway driving in AZ (the lower elevation combined with all highway driving definitely helped). I don't check the mileage very often. It would certainly be better if I had left it stock, but the lift and tires hurt me a little too.

Most of the GX 470's have the 3rd row and will have seating for 8, but the 3rd row is best suited for small children. My teenager is too tall to be comfortable back there.

With a quick KSL search, there are a few GX470's around in your range. If they have over 100k miles, they should have the timing belt done. That is about a $700-$1100 job depending on who does it and what they replace. I paid $1100 to have mine done, but it included a water pump, timing belt, tensioner, and other stuff I don't remember. I paid more than the Lexus dealer charges, but I had more replaced than what the Lexus dealer replaces for that service as a precaution.

The only mods I have done to mine that cost money are an OME lift, and new tires and wheels. You are welcome to drive mine and see how it looks/handles with a little lift and bigger tires. I am also happy to answer any questions about the GX you might have.

 

[mbryson]

I quite liked our GX470 (paid $10k for it last Nov with 140k). My wife did not (she traded for a 60k mile 2010 XTerra for $15k) and it's her daily driver so I just shut up. We drove a LOT of 4Runners from 2003-current. She liked the V8 Limited versions the best. Finding a Limited 4Runner under 100k is pretty brutal

 

[moab_cj5]

I quite liked our GX470 (paid $10k for it last Nov with 140k). My wife did not (she bought a 60k mile 2010 XTerra for $15k) and it's her daily driver so I just shut up. We drove a LOT of 4Runners from 2003-current. She liked the V8 Limited versions the best. Finding a Limited 4Runner under 100k is pretty brutal

This is what I ran into in my search, and what ultimately led to the GX. The 470 has the same V8, has the 3rd row, has more room inside than a 4Runner, and was cheaper when I was looking. Generally, the Lexus was more maintained too.


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[Kevin B.]

Why on earth is the Limited 4th gen 4Runner more than the 470? Toyota dorks are weird.

 

[StrobeNGH]

Would you walk from the Montero?

 

[moab_cj5]

Would you walk from the Montero?

My personal opinion is yes, walk away. If they just spent that much fixing, why are he selling?


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[mbryson]

Would you walk from the Montero?

I would. I think they are likely decent rigs but I'd not want to become an expert on them

 

[StrobeNGH]

Thank you! Now, on xterras... do they just not have good fit and finish, but are otherwise reliable, or are there other reasons why people don't like them?

 

[mbryson]

In my research, the 4.0L XTerra is the one to get. However, the 2005-07 had a few issues with a trans cooler that caused the milkshake of death (coolant getting into the trans). Supposedly that is fixed on '08 and newer? I don't hate the XTerra. Not what I would choose though. My wife LOVES it. You're welcome to come take a spin in hers if I can wrest the keys away. I'm in Woods Cross


it does only seat 5, so if you're wanting more seats, I'd look hard at as clean of a GX470 as you can find

 

[StrobeNGH]

Same issues with the last generation pathfinders?

 

[mbryson]

Same issues with the last generation pathfinders?

I'm not familar at all with the Pathfinders. I think they've left the SUV idea behind a long time ago

 

[Gravy]

I offroaded and modded lots of xterras. If they have an external trans cooler it's a non issue.

For what they are they are comfy, drive well and respond extremely well to mods. I've wheeled with the UXOC on pretty much every (non extreme) Moab trail and they do pretty good once you get used to a super flexy rear and a non flexy front.

I'm not the world's biggest Toy 4runner fan. (Although I've owned like 4 or 5 of them) only because I feel they're underpowered (unless you get a newer one) and people think they're made of Gold. People want 15k+ for a vehicle with 200k miles??? They are darn reliable (newer ones), but it doesn't matter the brand, that's still a time bomb, one negligent owner in 12 years and you're at the engine failure roulette wheel. (Again this only applies to this year and price range equating to a vehicle with higher miles).

 

[jeep-N-montero]

Montero will be the best bang for your dollar, overbuilt in stock form and really doesn't need many upgrades to tackle the same trails that built rigs go on. Read here http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/forums/94-Mitsubishi

 

[Kiel]

Avoid the Montero. We couldn't keep them on the road at my old dealership.... I'm talking 15 to 20 of them.

Pay the Toyota tax and keep going. Love our 100 Series.

 

[sixstringsteve]

I loved the ride of my Montero, best fire road driving rig I've owned, but there were too many electrical gremlins and I sold it the same month I bought it. Good suspension design, poor electronics and I didn't have confidence taking it far offroad. Another vote for a 2005-2009 4runner or gx470

 

[Kevin B.]

What about a full size? Sequoia, Expedition, Suburban, all go pretty cheap for what they are.

 

[jeep-N-montero]

I have owned owned the Monty for 3 years and had zero issues with it. As I mentioned, do some reading for yourself over on the portal and you will see why it is a great rig. You will even come upon a few threads where guys have tried to replace their Montero with a gx470 only to be disappointed.

 

[StrobeNGH]

I think I'm down to the GX470, 4Runner, or Nissan Pathfinder (last generation). For the $$$, I can get a newer pathfinder, with lower miles, than the toyotas... Are the Toyotas really that much more reliable?

 

[sixstringsteve]

They're probably not tons more reliable, but people think they are, which will really help you out when it comes time to sell it. You pay more for a toyota when you buy, but you get 90% of it back when you sell.

I'd also think about which one will be easier to get parts for.

I'd also venture to guess that the toyota forums have WAY more info on them than the pathfinder forums. So when something goes wrong, you'll be a lot more likely to find your answer on a toyota forum. Same thing with a jk. There's so much info on those JKs that no matter what problem you have, there are at least 3 other threads out there with someone with the same problem (and usually they have the solution too).

One other piece of advice I give people when buying a toyota is to not look for a deal. I know, it's tempting, but I recommend getting the exact one you want, even if you have to pay a little more. Most people who get "deals" on toyotas end up dealing with more problems than the average user, and they come to the conclusion that toyotas aren't reliable and aren't worth the price. Look at all the people that bought toyota 3.0 motors thinking they got a deal. They bought the cheapest toyota they could in that price range, and ended up getting burned. Shame on toyota for designing such a bad engine, but some people think that all toyotas are equally reliable. They're not. There are issues among them. Knowing what to look out for will really pay off.

In my opinion , with toyoas, vehicle condition and maintenance history is worth way more than low mileage. Toyotas have big problems when not properly maintained, not when the mileage gets high. The most reliable vehicle I ever had was a tacoma with 240k on it. It was well maintained, and not a single thing went wrong with it.

One more thing about the 4runners and the gx... beware of the ones with the digital hvac controls. Once those go out, there's no cheap way to fix them. I can't remember what years or models had these, but it's worth doing some research first before you buy the cheapest toyota you can find.