New XJ Owner

[metalry101]

(Insert Dr. Nick voice here) Hello Everybody!

So, I'm Ryan, I'm in Sandy, I pilot, yes, pilot an '88 XJ. Right now the only mods I've got are audio related. I'm working on getting either a Revolvers/ACOS lift and 30's or a one of 4 different lifts to clear 31's. I can't decide which to do, or which one I can afford. As for the audio, I run a Pioneer DEH550 (MP3/WMA compatible) and Diamond Audio 351i's front and rear. I've also got a pair on JL Audio 12W3's, a Sony 460, and a Sony 2165 waitin to go in. As for actual four wheelin' stuff, ehh, I take it up to Corner Canyon every once in a while, but I'm hoping to find some other people w/ similar rigs who like to wheel and know places to go.

 

[crimsonride]

Welcome, sounds like you got yourself a prime rig to build. There's lots of cherokee owners here, myself being one of them. You're going to wanna lift it a little in order to find a similar one on this board though.
Anyway, all the info you need can be found right here on this board, there's some of the best mechanics and shops on this forum.

-Chris

Just beware of Brett, his jeep sucks!

 

[yotaman]

[/QUOTE]Just beware of Brett, his jeep sucks![/QUOTE]

 

[utahxjer]

hey man welcome! check out www.rocky-road.com they have a good budget boost lift. Where you should be able to clear 30's.

 

[mbryson]

Just step and buy the 4.5" lift with the 33" tires and be done with your suspension mods.....................slight trimming required......

 

[iceaxe]

Ditto Utahxjer, the RRO budget boost is a good start untill you can save up/decide on what you want to do, requires no "extra" modifiations, and can be incorporated into future lift plans. It's what I'm running for now but hope to be stepping up to the next level soon! (closer to mbrysons suggestion) Tow points and other safety items are important as well and reqired for official club runs so keep that in mind before you spend all your dollars.

as far as people with simular rigs to wheel with, the XJ crowd is quite active. We just started a local chapter "Intermountain Chapter" of the North American XJ association www.naxja.org there is something going on all the time so check out the chapter forum at NAXJA and come on out. That and this forum should provide you with plenty of chances to wheel. oh yeah, i'm also in Sandy!

 

[metalry101]

Well, I've got the factory tow hooks in front and a reciever in rear. For safety, the only thing I've added is a fire extinguisher (spelling?). As for the 4.5" w/ 33's. If I do decide to go w/ the 4.5, I'll run 32's. The extra half an inch of clearance under the diffs isn't a concern for me. I've got the manual trans and no tow package, so I think that means I've got 3.07's in the diffs. Add that to the fact that my Jeep has 185K on the odometer and you get a lack of horsepower to turn bigger tires. I like clearance, but I drive it primarily on the street, so I can't kill it's power. Also, I'm a poor college kid, so regearing it isn't an option at this point in time, or any point in time in the remotely near future. Neither are aftermarket flares, which I'd need if I trimmed the fenders. As for Rocky Road, I've checked out their stuff. Looks to be of good quality. Do they let you pick stuff up if you order it from them? Obviously I don't want to pay 40 bux to have something shipped to me when I can spend 8 bux on gas and drive over there to pick it up. Anyways, I'm trying to decide what I want to do. I need new shocks, so that's a must, which makes a lot of the bigger kits more appealing, since they come w/ them. Also, I'm a fan of keeping tires on the ground, especially since I've got open diffs, and most of the good 3-4.5" kits flex pretty well. Anyways, I've gotta make some money before I decide. Also, I'm thinking that I want to run the Kumho Venture MT's, due to their great reviews and low cost on www.tirerack.com, but as you all know, we get a bit of snow here. So...know of any places that sipe tires? I know Les Schwab does it, anyone else? Well, thank you for all the suggestions, I appreciate it. Any more ideas would be helpful.

 

[utahxjer]

just so you know RRO, is in Heber not Park City.

 

[metalry101]

Forgot to ask...

I've got a few questions about different lifts. Besides the 2" kits and 30's, I'm considering...

Rusty's 3" and 31's

Rubicon Express 3.5" and 31's

Rusty's 4.5" and 32's

Rubicon Express 4.5" and 32's

Rockkrawler Suspensions 4.5" and 32's

So, all of the 4.5" kits come w/ a new track bar, but the 3 and 3.5" don't. Also, none of the 5 come w/ dropped pitman arm. So, would I need a new trackbar w/ the two that don't include it, and I'm 98% sure I'd need a dropped pitman arm w/ any of them. Is this correct? Anything else I'd need? I know I'd need some form of slip yoke eliminator w/ most of the kits, or at the very least, a transfer case drop kit. The SYE kits aren't exactly cheap, and I don't know how well the drop kit would work w/ a 4.5" kit. Anybody have any insight to this for me? Remember, broke college student, cheaper is better.

 

[mbryson]

You will NEED to regear with that many miles on your motor. Poor college kid or not........(I'm a poor married guy with three kids)..........Be creative........there's lots of 4 cyl. XJ's in salvage with 4.11 gears.......Seriously worth considering esp. on a Pick N Pull half price day or something.

There's nothing at all wrong with the 4.5" kit and 32" tires.

 

[metalry101]

Know any places that do regearing work for relatively cheap? I never thought of the salvage yard as a place to get the diffs, but actually, I've got an idea. Do you think it would be cheaper to take the entire axle (well, both) and just swap them in, rather than take the ring and pinion and get them installed? I don't know what they charge for axles, but I know regearing is about 1000 dollars w/ new parts and labor. Since all XJ's have basically the same axles (Well, newer ones have the 8.25 and a select few older models have a Dana 44), but I'm thinking all the older 4 poppers have D35's), would it bolt right up?

 

[JoeT]

Always good to see another XJ'er here. On RE stuff send my bro a e-mail about what you need. See he sells it from his home, so no overhead costs and very good deals. jolt@cableone.net Listen to Bryson ( Marc) he know his stuff. Now if need used XJ parts, talk to me. Or check my site for stuff that I'm partin out. www.jeepinjoe.com Be careful about that corner canyon area. I know people who were chased by helicopters there.

 

[mbryson]

Know any places that do regearing work for relatively cheap? I never thought of the salvage yard as a place to get the diffs, but actually, I've got an idea. Do you think it would be cheaper to take the entire axle (well, both) and just swap them in, rather than take the ring and pinion and get them installed? I don't know what they charge for axles, but I know regearing is about 1000 dollars w/ new parts and labor. Since all XJ's have basically the same axles (Well, newer ones have the 8.25 and a select few older models have a Dana 44), but I'm thinking all the older 4 poppers have D35's), would it bolt right up?

would it bolt right up?



We have a winner........!!!! Good luck on getting the D44. They're out there, but elusive. I have one under mine, and I got it at a salvage yard. The 8.25 is a fairly decent piece if you get the newer 29 spline version. They'll hold up to some abuse with 33" tires. I ran my D35 with 33" Swamps. I drove it like a grandma and literally carried a whole housing with me on my camp trailer tongue on longer trips where I might need spare parts. Be prepared to fix your junk if you run the crappy axles.


.........of course, there's always people upgrading.

 

[metalry101]

JeepinJoe~
Thanx for the heads up about Corner Canyon. I'll remember to be on the lookout. I'm always careful up there, and stay on the trails that have already been established so as not to destroy more of the canyon (not that it necessarily matters, they're building houses in the damn thing anyways). But of course, I do always try to practice Tread Lightly's principles. Anyways, I bookmarked your site so I that I remember to check it out every once in a while. What's ur bro's screen name? I'll have to PM him or something so I can get an idea of how he could help me out. Thanx a bunch for all the info.

Also, Marc~
I don't think I said thanx for your advice. I'll definately look into finding money for gearing as well, b4 I get a lift. Do you think the stock axles would stand up to the abuse? I like my corners and everything on the street, but off-road, I don't have too bad of a tendancy to be over aggressive w/ the stupid pedal. Usually more of the opposite, I'll try an obstacle a bunch of different times till I can find the right amount of throttle input, tire placement, etc. Obviously right now I'm not putting down too much horsepower, but I do want to add a K&N, Safari Snorkel, Thorley Exhaust (header and catback), MSD ignition, and maybe a couple of other power enhancers in the future. So, the point being, would the stock axles handle 32's w/ average power? I've read that they should, at least w/ reasonable driving and open diffs, but you seem to have quite a bit of experience, so I'd like your opinion as well. Also, how difficult is it to install a dropped pitman arm? As for the 44, well, that'd be nice, but then I'd have to get new gears. Would it be worth it for my application? Would it require any fabrication? I know the bolt pattern is the same, but would the stock driveshaft work or would I need a new one, and is the brake hookup the same, etc?

 

[utahxjer]

I'd say save your 2-300 bucks on a snorkel.. I use to want one but I don't see any use for it around here. I only know of one xj that has a snorkel in Utah, and I dought he's needed it.

 

[metalry101]

Well I just like the snorkel cuz it looks sexy and it's supposed to act like a little bit of a cold air intake, so it adds a little power. But mostly just because it looks sexy. If I did get a snorkel, it would be after I got all the things that I needed, and the more functional things. I really don't plan on submerging my Jeep. I love my speakers way way way way way way way way (I'm thinking you get point) too much to do that to them.

 

[mbryson]

........................
Also, Marc~
I don't think I said thanx for your advice. I'll definately look into finding money for gearing as well, b4 I get a lift. Do you think the stock axles would stand up to the abuse? I like my corners and everything on the street, but off-road, I don't have too bad of a tendancy to be over aggressive w/ the stupid pedal. Usually more of the opposite, I'll try an obstacle a bunch of different times till I can find the right amount of throttle input, tire placement, etc. Obviously right now I'm not putting down too much horsepower, but I do want to add a K&N, Safari Snorkel, Thorley Exhaust (header and catback), MSD ignition, and maybe a couple of other power enhancers in the future. So, the point being, would the stock axles handle 32's w/ average power?

yes, been there done that, have a few t-shirts (most have grease spots on them now) and honestly enjoyed my rig as much as I ever have with the 32" tires.

I haven't altered from stock on my engine. No throttle body spacers, headers, K&N's that all add up to an additional 12 horsepower. I just never felt it was worth it. I spent my money on my lockers and gears and cobbled together my lift.

I'd suggest learning what each modification will do to alter FROM stock. The engineers did a fairly reasonable job of setting up your rig from the factory. Nothing wrong with following their lead. Bigger tires will effectively decrease your axle ratio. If you think your rig is kind of slow with the 3.07 gears, add taller tires. If you do the math, your gear ratio will lower with the taller tires. It'll feel like you have 2.8x gears. Talk about a not satisfying driving experience........

I've read that they should, at least w/ reasonable driving and open diffs, but you seem to have quite a bit of experience, so I'd like your opinion as well.

I ran my D30, and D35 with 4.10 gears (used--4 cyl. swapage) with 32 & 33" tires. I felt like I was really pushing the D35 with the 33" and I've seen people break D35 with 31" tires. Be wary of the D35. Don't invest any money into it......diff fluid is more investment than it's worth. {just my opinion}

Also, how difficult is it to install a dropped pitman arm? As for the 44, well, that'd be nice, but then I'd have to get new gears. Would it be worth it for my application?

I'm still running a stock pitman arm. You can install one fairly easily. If you can find an XJ D44, buy it if it's under $300 or so. Good money spent. They usually come with 3.55 gears. Get the front axle (or a junker) to match and with your five speed, you'll be relatively close to stock final drive with 31" tires. (4.10s would be better with your miles, IMHO)

Would it require any fabrication? I know the bolt pattern is the same, but would the stock driveshaft work or would I need a new one, and is the brake hookup the same, etc?

Driveshaft may need to be shortened as the D35/D44 length is quite different. I have no firsthand knowledge of the 8.25. HOWEVER, when I went from a D35 to a D44, I also added another 2" of lift. My slip yoke driveline worked great with the added length of the D44.




Most of all, SEARCH the bb.....read, but question everything you read with your own logic. There are some real dumb@sses on the boards and some real knowledgable people.

I think I've learned more by watching and trying (4 low--that other shifter in your console ) than by reading and theorizing.......Have fun!!!........

 

[metalry101]

Oh trust me, I know where the lever for 4-low is. The 2-speed transfer case is definately one of God's greatest gifts to mankind . Anyways, it's sounding like I'm gonna need a helluva lotta money to get the thing in the air (hence my attraction to the 2" kits). Damn, I'm gonna have to think about whether or not I can afford all this. I mean I could save up for a while (like a year or more, depending if I get kicked out or not), but I'm not sure whether it would be worth it. I don't wheel that often, or that hard. I'd like to get into it more, but I really don't have the bank account to fix things that I'd break and whatever wears out, etc. Hmm... sounds like I've got a lot of thinking to do. I'd love to have a relatively big XJ that's very capable, but I'm not sure I'd be able to use it enough to justify everything I'd have to give up in order to afford it, at least at this point in time. I'm starting to think that maybe running the 2" kit w/ some good 30's, armoring the hell out of it, and learning the basics of wheeling (through wheeling it of course) would be my best bet for the time being.

 

[utahxjer]

good ideas.

You can get it up to 3" or so relatively cheap. You can use older Dodge Dakota leafs from a junkyard(3" of lift) and people are always selling smaller lift coils, springs, control arms. Check out www.jeepsunlimited.com cherokee for sale section, www.naxja.org for sale section. You'll find some killer deals sooner or later.

 

[RockMonkey]

Always good to see another XJ'er here. On RE stuff send my bro a e-mail about what you need. See he sells it from his home, so no overhead costs and very good deals. jolt@cableone.net Listen to Bryson ( Marc) he know his stuff. Now if need used XJ parts, talk to me. Or check my site for stuff that I'm partin out. www.jeepinjoe.com Be careful about that corner canyon area. I know people who were chased by helicopters there.

Chased by helicopters??? Man, that would suck... :-\



Oh, BTW, just to clear the air about said incident. It WAS on an existing trail, not out thrashing the weeds.