Putting together a nasty SBC

[Greg]

Back in the day I built a great little small block Chevy for my '71 Camaro... it had some nice parts, Dart Sportsman heads & intake, roller valvetrain, etc. It was an honest 400 HP motor and pulled hard to 6500 RPM. I had a machine shop do the machine work and install the cam bearings, then I put it together myself. I was 18 yrs old and never built a motor before... after reading 3 books on the standards of SBC building and triple-checking all my assembly specs, I did the final assembly. It ran well for quite a few years, getting flogged weekly and never had a problem.

Recently I've getting the urge to build another SBC... for an unknown project, probably some kind of rat rod. I want to build this one even nastier... big, lumpy cam, mid to high compression, and I've even considered using a 6" rod kit. I don't think I'd do a roller cam this time, even though I'm a believer in them. I'd like to try keep the project low-buck, but shoot for 450 HP. Low buck and 6" rods....

I think a set of good heads (perhaps Vortec heads?), a lumpy cam, and decent intake and carb, I'd be there. Here's some of the parts I've been eye-balling...


Summit Racing offers this 6" rod rotating assembly kit from Scat, cast crank with forged pistons for $900.- http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=SCA-1-90255&view=1&N=700+#footnote

Camshaft, 3000 to 6500 RPM range, $90. - http://store.summitracing.com/partdetail.asp?part=SUM-K1107&autoview=sku

That's about as far along as I've made it... a 400 CID motor with 6" rods would be badass...

Any thoughts?

 

[GOAT]

Ford engine would be a good start............sorry had to

The most fun I had was when I was running built N/A motors with a stickshift.

I know very little about SBC parts. The LS1s I used to dyno were pretty impressive though. Seems like a good starting point.

 

[Greg]

Ford engine would be a good start............sorry had to

The most fun I had was when I was running built N/A motors with a stickshift.

I know very little about SBC parts. The LS1s I used to dyno were pretty impressive though. Seems like a good starting point.

Ford... only if I want the same HP for 2x the money. I'm not a Ford fan at all.

LS1's are badass, but I want to go old-school. EFI & rat rods just don't mix IMO.

 

[GOAT]

Ford... only if I want the same HP for 2x the money. I'm not a Ford fan at all.

LS1's are badass, but I want to go old-school. EFI & rat rods just don't mix IMO.

We should turn this into a ford VS chevy thread, and only use obscure technical references

I owned one 02' chevy sierra for nine hours. It left me stranded. Returned it bought my POS V10. 175K and still going.

Understand the rat rod thing. Those are way cool. You'll end up having to run some old-school offy intake

 

[chadschoon]

I had one that we made into a 383 stroker. 6" rods high compression, forged pistons and crank. big crower cam, dart sportsman II heads 150 shot of NOS. it was freaking fast! I want it back

 

[Greg]

A friend of mine built a de-stroked 400 (400 block w/ 350 crank) that was insane. That could be a cool build, they are the opposite of a 383 and turn high RPM's very well. A 6" rod de-stroked 400 would have a nice flat torque curve and spin some serious revs.

That would be a fun build if you could find a good block. My friends engine had Trick Flow Alum heads, about 11.5 to 1 compression and a massive roller cam. It spun to 8500 RPM. That thing was a 700+ HP car... and he drive it to work about once I week. You'd hear him coming from 4 blocks away... fast as hell car with a 4500 RPM stall converter... First time he ran it at RMR with a bit of NOS, he turned a 9 sec quarter and got kicked off the track... :greg:

 

[Tacoma]

I think you're onto a good thing, Greg, and I support you 100%.

You have probably already looked, but racingjunk.com has SWEET deals on used race parts that should live about forever on the street, for CHEAP. I'm thinking of building a stroker Rat motor on the "cheap" using parts bought online.
Obviously, clearances get really critical w/6" rods... so watch out! and full speed ahead.

anyway.

 

[Tacoma]

TopTruck Tom is always after me to build a 377, and spin the hell out of it. It's tempting, and cheapish. Circle track motor. He likes noise.

 

[Greg]

We should turn this into a ford VS chevy thread, and only use obscure technical references

I owned one 02' chevy sierra for nine hours. It left me stranded. Returned it bought my POS V10. 175K and still going.

Understand the rat rod thing. Those are way cool. You'll end up having to run some old-school offy intake

I prefer having 5 head bolts surrounding my cylinders vs 4... not sure if that's obscure enough for ya.

When I had my Camaro I used to drive around picking on Mustangs... :greg: Never lost to one, but embarrassed many.

An old dual carbed tunnel ram would be fun... unnecessary, but cool.

I had one that we made into a 383 stroker. 6" rods high compression, forged pistons and crank. big crower cam, dart sportsman II heads 150 shot of NOS. it was freaking fast! I want it back

Bet that was a screamer! What were the estimated HP/TQ rating?

 

[GOAT]

]

When I had my Camaro I used to drive around picking on Mustangs... :greg: Never lost to one, but embarrassed many.

Auto 4.6 convertibles don't count

What rod ratio do you end up with a 6" rod? 383s and 454s have horrible rod ratios.

 

[chadschoon]

I never had it dyno'd when I built it. it was supposed to turn 400 hp without the NOS. it would almost pick the front end of my 1971 chevy off the ground. we had it in the low 12's at RMR. I always wanted to put that motor in a car and see what it could really do.

 

[Tacoma]

An old dual carbed tunnel ram would be fun... unnecessary, but cool.

That would rock in a rat rod.

 

[Greg]

Auto 4.6 convertibles don't count

What rod ratio do you end up with a 6" rod? 383s and 454s have horrible rod ratios.

This was before the 4.6 time, those were 302 cars... A few 60's Mustangs, mostly 90's 5.0 Mustangs that thought they were fast... My Manager at Super Shops had a decently-build '92 5.0 that I drove a few times. I'll admit it was a fun car to drive... but my Camaro was quicker. The closest Ford race I ever had was a badass Ranger that had a very built 302. We street raced a few times down University in Provo one Friday night and it was always dead-even... the race ended abruptly when one of Provo's Finest saw us coming over the viaduct pushing 100 MPH. Young and dumb.... but it was fun. We both got away... :greg:

A Stock 350 Chevy has a 1.64:1 RL/S ratio, which is not very good. By increasing the rod length to 6" the ratio increases to 1.72:1.

From- http://www.hotrodders.com/forum/stroke-rod-ratio-32680.html

A 6" rod in a SBC is supposed to provide a noticeable increase in torque, better top-end RPM's and you can run more aggressive timing, since the piston dwell is increased over the 5.7 rod.

I never had it dyno'd when I built it. it was supposed to turn 400 hp without the NOS. it would almost pick the front end of my 1971 chevy off the ground. we had it in the low 12's at RMR. I always wanted to put that motor in a car and see what it could really do.

That engine I built ended up in my first Jeep, my '80 CJ5 with a 4 speed. That thing was fun as hell to drive... I raced another Mustang in that Jeep, beat him and then watched him get pulled over... That thing was a total sleeper, I raced lots of muscle cars with good success.

Ben Hanks knew that Jeep, ask him about it. It was no rock crawler, but it went like hell. It would twist the frame and the right-rear would squat and the drivers-front tire would come off the ground... in every gear. :greg:

 

[chadschoon]

 

[LT.]

When are you thinking about starting this project? I think that this would be a killer build. I really like your ideas for keeping to the budget theme. It seems more fitting for a rat rod. If you do this would you be posting it up here on the site?

LT.

 

[Greg]

When are you thinking about starting this project? I think that this would be a killer build. I really like your ideas for keeping to the budget theme. It seems more fitting for a rat rod. If you do this would you be posting it up here on the site?

LT.

Right now it's just talk... online bench racing, if you will. I regret selling my Dodge Modified project and hanging out with Badbuggy has been making me want to build another rat rod. I think that if I build another mean SBC I'd have more vested interest in getting the car up and driving.

I would love to build a 30's pickup with this mean SBC and a 4 speed transmission, chopped and channeled, origional faded paint... If I did something like this, I would post it up here.

 

[Tacoma]

You need a block?

 

[Greg]

You need a block?

Whatcha got?

 

[Tacoma]

I'll have a TBI block I think.. perfect for an overbore. it's "well-seasoned".

 

[Greg]

I'll have a TBI block I think.. perfect for an overbore. it's "well-seasoned".

I already have a TBI block I cant get rid of... I'd rather use a late 60's, early 70's 4 bolt main, but that TBI block would probably do the job.