Rubicon Shakedown Run #3: Hanging Tree Trail

[sixstringsteve]

I'll put you on the waiting list Bryce, the initial 8 spots are full at the moment. If anyone drops out we'll put you in their spot. Sorry to have to limit it, but rockreligious and I agree that 8 rigs is a lot to get through that trail without taking all day.

 

[Max Power]

Didn't see the post above that said it was full.

 

[sixstringsteve]

someone usually drops out last minute, so I'd still plan on going Bryce.

 

[Max Power]

Will do.

 

[TurboMinivan]

Well, crap. I saw Steve's other two Shakedown threads, but I didn't say much in them since getting a Saturday off work takes an act of Congress for me. I was able to shrug them off since they are trails which I have run many many times in the past; I didn't feel like I would be missing much (other than camping out, which I really need to do once or twice).

But HTT is different. This is a trail I really want to run! Furthermore, it sounds like it would be a good little practice run before heading out to the Rubicon Trail.

I guess I'll just have to be content with being the next in line.

 

[TurboMinivan]

Oh, wait--this just in (from another thread):

Dempsey, just my personal opinion, and maybe it's just me, but I wouldn't try Hanging Tree without at least 35" tires and lockers front and rear. I know there are exceptions to rules, but I don't like massive rock stacking and catastrophic failures in groups that I'm with.

So you're saying HTT is harder than the Rubicon Trail? And you're also saying that HTT is harder than Constrictor?

 

[sixstringsteve]

yes, it's harder than constrictor. I've heard it's harder than the Rubicon as well, but I don't know. I didn't think hanging tree seemed very difficult last time I rode along with it, but it'll be entirely different driving an ifs rig with an open front diff.

 

[jmaxj]

Oh, wait--this just in (from another thread):



So you're saying HTT is harder than the Rubicon Trail? And you're also saying that HTT is harder than Constrictor?

yes to both, rubicon isn't major hard it's just long, and well constrictor is constrictor. HTT has them both beat IMO.

yes, it's harder than constrictor. I've heard it's harder than the Rubicon as well, but I don't know. I didn't think hanging tree seemed very difficult last time I rode along with it, but it'll be entirely different driving an ifs rig with an open front diff.

i wouldn't do it, if your attempting HTT with and open front diff'd IFS rig i'll make sure to NOT be on the trail that day.

 

[TurboMinivan]

if your attempting HTT with and open front diff'd IFS rig i'll make sure to NOT be on the trail that day.

This belief doesn't really agree with your signature.

 

[jmaxj]

HTT isn't too easy for many buggies i've seen

That signature was put there back in '05 when i caught a bunch of buggy's from here on metal masher driving wherever they felt, when i confronted them they said "well this trail is too easy so we had to make it harder" so after reporting them and such i put it there so they knew it was me.(and they did)


but for the record i've ran the rubicon 3 times and one time i was on bald 32" A/T's and lockers, the trail was doable but difficult. i would never even consider running HTT the way it is now with that setup.

 

[sixstringsteve]

i wouldn't do it, if your attempting HTT with and open front diff'd IFS rig i'll make sure to NOT be on the trail that day.

I'm not worried. I've been through the trail as a passenger, and there's nothing there that really worries me. There are definitely lines that I can't make, but I think every obstacle (except for the last waterfall) will have a line that I can do. I did escalator, tip over challenge, double whammy, and potato salad hill in an open front diff ifs tacoma. I understand that HTT is different than those obstacles, but I really think I'll be fine. I'll have the best spotters I know of. If I'm holding the group up, then I'll turn around and head out and let them continue the trail.

 

[jmaxj]

not just different obstacles but different terrain, those obstacles have have traction except potato but that's hit and miss. HTT lately has mud on the rocks to which there isn't much for traction, add wet tires to the mix and well......good luck

 

[Bart]

I was serious when I posted that message and agree with jmaxj on his comments. The obstacles that Steve made in Moab have a lot to do with wheelbase and traction, which in my opinion would hinder more than help on HTT. There are several waterfall climbs in HTT with different lines, but for me, I wouldn't take my stretched TJ on it because my front Dana 60 is still open, even though it's on 37s with a rear locker. I think I could make it with rock stacking and skinny pedal, but its more carnage and risk than I care to put it through which is why I've already turned down the opportunity this summer. I've seen way too many built rigs limp out of there on the few times I've been there. Again, this is just my opinion, and more power to those that prove me wrong, Many have. I've been mistaken before and I know it'll happen again. Steve's a good driver from what I've seen and he's seen the trail and knows what his rig can do, and that's half the battle. If you go, good luck and GET ER DONE!

 

[sixstringsteve]

Thanks for the warning guys. The trail must have gotten a lot tougher than when I rode along last summer. I appreciate you guys warning me. I'll just plan to go as far as I can then turn around.

Bart, I must admit that if you don't think you can get your rig through there, I don't stand a chance. You've got 100 times the driving skill I do, and your rig is way more prepared than mine.

We'll see just how far I can make it. I know when to take a strap and when to back off an obstacle. I'll do my best to turn around before I break anything.

 

[Bart]

Sounds like a good plan. BTW, I didn't say I couldn't get it through there, but said I didn't want to put the extra time, energy, and vehicle abuse in to make it through. Same reason I haven't run Pritchett in this configuration. The front Spartan should be coming in July and then it wont be a problem. BTW, the last time I ran the trail was last year also.

Edit <Adding on to this.> My trail philosophy has changed in my old age. When I run a hard trail, I want to run it clean, without depending on stacking rocks, or even a spotter. I don't expect others to do this, it's just me. I'll take a spot if I get in trouble, but don't want to depend on it. I also like to run hard trails with people I trust and that have dependable equipment, built as well or better than mine. Trail rides only go as fast as the slowest person, and I don't want to be the one holding up the group. This is not to say I don't like to be challenged, in fact quite the opposite. But I do know the limitations of my skills and my rig.

Here's an example. A group of us went to Montrose one year and a friend from California brought a buddy of his in a pristine CJ7. It was not built like the rest of ours and only had stock gears. In two days he'd added quite a bit of body damage and rock rash, broke 2 front axle shafts, and completely wasted his clutch. He was not having fun and the trails were taking forever. We were all nice and patient, but he ended up parking it for the last 2 days and had a terrible experience. BTW, the first 2 days we ran the easiest trails there.

I do like to go with less experienced and less built rigs, but only on trails and obstacles where they'll have fun and be challenged. Leading Hell's Revenge at EJS and taking family and friends to the Snakes is a blast for me, but my approach to those runs is completely different. Like I said, it's prolly just my old grumpy age coming through.

 

[BCGPER]

I concur with everything you’ve said…..


Well, everything except that listening to your spotter crap.

My trail philosophy has changed in my old age. When I run a hard trail, I want to run it clean, without depending on stacking rocks, or even a spotter. I don't expect others to do this, it's just me. I'll take a spot if I get in trouble, but don't want to depend on it. I also like to run hard trails with people I trust and that have dependable equipment, built as well or better than mine. Trail rides only go as fast as the slowest person, and I don't want to be the one holding up the group. This is not to say I don't like to be challenged, in fact quite the opposite. But I do know the limitations of my skills and my rig.

Here's an example. A group of us went to Montrose one year and a friend from California brought a buddy of his in a pristine CJ7. It was not built like the rest of ours and only had stock gears. In two days he'd added quite a bit of body damage and rock rash, broke 2 front axle shafts, and completely wasted his clutch. He was not having fun and the trails were taking forever. We were all nice and patient, but he ended up parking it for the last 2 days and had a terrible experience. BTW, the first 2 days we ran the easiest trails there.

I do like to go with less experienced and less built rigs, but only on trails and obstacles where they'll have fun and be challenged. Leading Hell's Revenge at EJS and taking family and friends to the Snakes is a blast for me, but my approach to those runs is completely different. Like I said, it's prolly just my old grumpy age coming through.

 

[mbryson]

.....Edit <Adding on to this.> My trail philosophy has changed in my old age. When I run a hard trail, I want to run it clean, without depending on stacking rocks, or even a spotter. I don't expect others to do this, it's just me. I'll take a spot if I get in trouble, but don't want to depend on it. I also like to run hard trails with people I trust and that have dependable equipment, built as well or better than mine. Trail rides only go as fast as the slowest person, and I don't want to be the one holding up the group. This is not to say I don't like to be challenged, in fact quite the opposite. But I do know the limitations of my skills and my rig.
....
I do like to go with less experienced and less built rigs, but only on trails and obstacles where they'll have fun and be challenged. Leading Hell's Revenge at EJS and taking family and friends to the Snakes is a blast for me, but my approach to those runs is completely different. Like I said, it's prolly just my old grumpy age coming through.

Kind of my take as well. I'm not near as "experienced" as Bart or BC. They've got a half century on me. (oh, I'll be watching for either of you to hit me with your cane)

 

[BCGPER]

I wouldn't hit you, but it'll be funny to trip you in your walker.

They've got a half century on me. (oh, I'll be watching for either of you to hit me with your cane)

 

[Tacoma]

"A man has got to know his limitations." "Discretion is the better part of valor." etc.

 

[TurboMinivan]

That signature was put there back in '05 when i caught a bunch of buggy's from here on metal masher driving wherever they felt, when i confronted them they said "well this trail is too easy so we had to make it harder" so after reporting them and such i put it there so they knew it was me.(and they did)

Oh, gotcha.

I was serious when I posted that message and agree with jmaxj on his comments.

And I greatly appreciate that you said it, Bart. As I'm sure you know, I have great respect for you--both your experience and your ability. I highly value your opinion on matters such as this, especially considering you have run both of the trails mentioned (Rubicon and HTT) while I've yet to even see either one of them.

For the rest of you who don't know me, I'm not some loudmouth hotshot punk who thinks I am Billy Bad Ass and can handle any terrain. I do have a fair amount of experience and I'm willing to try things slightly above my rig's perceived capability, but I do have my limits and I won't do anything outright foolish. Truth be told, I didn't know HTT was that tough--all I've seen of it is one 10-second video clip of an XJ climbing a wet rocky hill of some sort. I thought maybe that was one of the hardest obstacles on the trail... but I guess not.


I had lunch with my wife today, and I started rambling about the difficulty of HTT and how this trip would have been a great warmup for our Rubicon run in September if only my Jeep were capable enough to try it. She asked me what it would take for me to be able to run HTT. I said I figured I'd at least need my 4" lift, 35" tires, 4.56 gears and another Air Locker (all of which are in my long-term plans for this Jeep anyway). She asked me how much all that would cost, and I tried not to wince as I told her. After a brief pause, she looked at me and simply said, "You know, if you want to go ahead and build up the Jeep now with all that stuff before you go run the Rubicon, I'll fully support you in that."



Words cannot express how much I love this woman.


I'm not sure if I can pull it all off, but I'm gonna give it my very best effort. I've got a lot of work to do!