This website sucks
- Thread starter EZRhino
- Start date
- Location
- Bountiful, land of rocks
It's not like they're misrepresenting anything 
Oh, and they provide 'solutions' also. Never mind that the grazing rights have been effect for at least 150 years.
Another quote "Studies show that communities near protected wilderness are economically resilient.".............WTF does that mean? I know if Moab lost it's tourism revenue, that town would DIE.........What studies? Could you give a few examples?
Oh, another "Oil and gas exploration and development is one of the major causes of environmental destruction in SE Utah. But most geologists agree that very little energy remains to be tapped outside the areas already developed. If every remaining undeveloped area in Utah were filled with drill pads, it would extend our national oil supply by about 3 weeks and our natural gas supply by less than 5 months."........................No oil company can afford that many drill rigs. Also if that's all the oil they think they'll get out of the wells, you can't cost justify drilling. The FIRST week or so of drilling (local Uinta Basin knowledge here) the drilling company spends $300,000 per day. That's with absolutely NO REVENUE. You can bet the oil companies just drill anywhere they feel like it.
Edit: My wife and I went over rough costs to drill last night (she works for an oil company that drills very similarly to any of the wells in the region). Just to drill costs about $200K (exploratory). They pay their geoligists pretty well in order to ensure they don't tell them to drill in a poor location. After the exploratory drilling, they put another $250-350K in the well before any production begins. Those are 'hard numbers'. Actual.
Sorry for my quick rants.
Oh, and they provide 'solutions' also. Never mind that the grazing rights have been effect for at least 150 years.
Another quote "Studies show that communities near protected wilderness are economically resilient.".............WTF does that mean? I know if Moab lost it's tourism revenue, that town would DIE.........What studies? Could you give a few examples?
Oh, another "Oil and gas exploration and development is one of the major causes of environmental destruction in SE Utah. But most geologists agree that very little energy remains to be tapped outside the areas already developed. If every remaining undeveloped area in Utah were filled with drill pads, it would extend our national oil supply by about 3 weeks and our natural gas supply by less than 5 months."........................No oil company can afford that many drill rigs. Also if that's all the oil they think they'll get out of the wells, you can't cost justify drilling. The FIRST week or so of drilling (local Uinta Basin knowledge here) the drilling company spends $300,000 per day. That's with absolutely NO REVENUE. You can bet the oil companies just drill anywhere they feel like it.
Edit: My wife and I went over rough costs to drill last night (she works for an oil company that drills very similarly to any of the wells in the region). Just to drill costs about $200K (exploratory). They pay their geoligists pretty well in order to ensure they don't tell them to drill in a poor location. After the exploratory drilling, they put another $250-350K in the well before any production begins. Those are 'hard numbers'. Actual.
Sorry for my quick rants.
- Location
- Sandy, Ut
Not even gonna check it out... I can already tell it will do nothing but anger me...
hammerhead
Junkyard Dog
- Location
- Southern Utah
The problem with that is thay tricked you into signing a petition supporting their cause. That comments option is a joke. Just more lies and deceptions. They didn't want your comment. They wanted another name to add to a list. A list they use to show how many people support the pseudo-enviro agenda...
I didn't submit it with a proper name, unless they can pester the email service for a registered name I don't think they will have anything usefull. lets see if I get a reply thanking me for supporting the cause. They can also try to claim the number of hits to the website as evidence of support (the old use of statistics to prove whatever you want trick).
Once upon a time I wrote a chapter in a book about the economics of wilderness. Some head full of mush professor in Montana (at that time) thought that the more wilderness around an area the better off it is economically. OK so let's explore that idea. Let's take JUST recreation/tourism. What activities are allowed in wilderness? Walking. That's pretty much it. Maybr river rafting. How much money is spent by people in the local town who participate in these activities? Now compare that to how much people spend whith motorized vehicles. Now add mountain bikes. Now add snowmobiles. Now add all the people who are either unable, unfit, or too little to walk in a wilderness area (elderly and kids) but can recreate with vehicle based recreation. And don't forget that typical tree hugging soap dodging hippies don;t spend any money when they go on trips other than for gas.
Vehicle based recreation makes a lot more money than wilderness recreation.
Don't even get me started on oil jobs vs. tourism jobs....
EZ
Vehicle based recreation makes a lot more money than wilderness recreation.
Don't even get me started on oil jobs vs. tourism jobs....
EZ
The arguement makes no sense at first. So they are talking about these studies, and I'm looking up at 3 wilderness areas perfectly visible from the economic center of the State and I can see thier unique and rugged beauty and why protection from developement is a good idea and looking back down at all the hustle and bustle I can also see why the economy is resilient. I don't see how this compares to more remote areas of the state, even Moab. That's a little different and especially Moab because the recreationists and Park visitors support that economy. Closing down recreational oppertunities would do the opposite of what they are claiming wouldn't it? but the crux of it all is that is exactly what they want, to shut down the recreationists. Now it starts to make sense on their side of it, shady shady sense. Nice little bit of double talk from wannabe big brother aka the greens.....
- Location
- Bountiful, land of rocks
iceaxe said:................. Nice little bit of double talk from wannabe big brother aka the greens.....
Exactly, promote what you want to, twist the logic......
XJEEPER
Well-Known Member
- Location
- Highland Springs
# In order to facilitate enforcement, there should be a "closed unless signed open" policy. The large majority of visitors to SE Utah want to obey the law and stay on designated trails. This policy makes it very easy for visitors to determine what's legal and what's not.
# As use levels increase, combining non-motorized and motorized users on the same trail system becomes unacceptable. No one likes hiking, mountain biking or riding horses on a trail crowded with motorcycles and ATVs. There needs to be a fair allocation between motorized and non-motorized users.
This is simple, single track trails are open to only hikers, bikers and horses. Two track trails and roads are open to OHV's only. Seems really simple, doesn't it?
#Vehicles should be restricted to designated roads and trails throughout the entire resource areas -- no "open" ORV play areas. Even some off-road vehicle advocacy groups agree that unrestricted driving off of established routes is no longer acceptable. (This does not mean that there cannot be ORV-emphasis areas where there is a high density of designated routes.)
# In addition, the existence of roads clearly exacerbates the threats and vandalism to the world-class cultural resources of southeastern Utah.
HUH?????
Definition:
Envormental Extremist- an individual or group possessing the finely honed skills of gathering money from easily deceived holders of wealth who get warm feelings from donating to any cause. Also possessing the ability to manipulate the truth to support their agenda, massage the data to increase the support, and talk out of both ends of their body at any given time.
Approach with extreme caution, they have also been known to spike trees, booby trap trails, turn loose 1000's of head of domesticated livestock which are unable to survive on their own, vandalize machinery, set fire to lumber, oil and auto businesses.......all in the name of good.
# As use levels increase, combining non-motorized and motorized users on the same trail system becomes unacceptable. No one likes hiking, mountain biking or riding horses on a trail crowded with motorcycles and ATVs. There needs to be a fair allocation between motorized and non-motorized users.
This is simple, single track trails are open to only hikers, bikers and horses. Two track trails and roads are open to OHV's only. Seems really simple, doesn't it?
#Vehicles should be restricted to designated roads and trails throughout the entire resource areas -- no "open" ORV play areas. Even some off-road vehicle advocacy groups agree that unrestricted driving off of established routes is no longer acceptable. (This does not mean that there cannot be ORV-emphasis areas where there is a high density of designated routes.)
# In addition, the existence of roads clearly exacerbates the threats and vandalism to the world-class cultural resources of southeastern Utah.
HUH?????
Definition:
Envormental Extremist- an individual or group possessing the finely honed skills of gathering money from easily deceived holders of wealth who get warm feelings from donating to any cause. Also possessing the ability to manipulate the truth to support their agenda, massage the data to increase the support, and talk out of both ends of their body at any given time.
Approach with extreme caution, they have also been known to spike trees, booby trap trails, turn loose 1000's of head of domesticated livestock which are unable to survive on their own, vandalize machinery, set fire to lumber, oil and auto businesses.......all in the name of good.
Last edited:
Broken
Member
- Location
- Saratoga Springs
nice
XJEEPER Definition: Envormental Extremist- an individual or group possessing the finely honed skills of gathering money from easily deceived holders of wealth who get warm feelings from donating to any cause. Also possessing the ability to manipulate the truth to support their agenda said: