vehicle registration question?

[Ghost Crawler]

I am seeking advice and support to have a law formed that will allow off-road crawlers/Jeep's to be legally registered in the state of Utah. I had my Jeep impounded this last weekend in Moab for no registration. I have contacted the state DMV and they informed me that Congress needs to be involved to form a new law that allows our vehicles to be registered.

 

[Rusted]

Something wrong with getting it registered as an OHV?

You can choose if you want to play by the "street legal" rules and drive it on the street as well, and if not you can go OHV and drive it offroad.

Can you give more details as to what your idea is or what you need?

 

[spaggyroe]

I am seeking advice and support to have a law formed that will allow off-road crawlers/Jeep's to be legally registered in the state of Utah.

I don't understand your post. You can already register it as an off-road vehicle, similar to a 4-wheeler, etc. You would, of course, have to trailer your rig to the trailhead. If you want your jeep to remain street legal, you simply have to comply to the lift laws / regulations / etc.

I had my Jeep impounded this last weekend in Moab for no registration. I have contacted the state DMV and they informed me that Congress needs to be involved to form a new law that allows our vehicles to be registered.

I understand that you're upset and frustrated with having your jeep impounded, but this statement is pretty vague. "Our vehicles" range from factory fresh JK's to full blown competion crawlers.

I wish you good luck but that's going to be an uphill battle my friend.

 

[Ghost Crawler]

the problem with registering it as an OHV is that I will have to surrender my VIN number. I will also have to take off my windshield, and some other things that I am not willing to do. The problem with the current Utah laws are that there is no law pertaining to modified Jeeps that WON'T pass safety inspection. Of course, I could find a buddy who will let it pass safety inspection, but then if you get caught with registration and the vehicle obvioulsy won't pass safety inspection- on or off-road, the mechanic shop will loose thier license to do further inspections. Pretty much you have to break the law to keep the law. We are trying to have a law created to fix this problem. To do this you have to contact you local Congressman. Currently, we are working on drafting a Bill to be presented at next year's legislation.

 

[Bucking Bronco]

If your vehicle cant pass then it probably should not be on the road for the safety of others. Most of us throw some fender flares on and some mudflaps and it passes if yours is so heavily modified it cant pass then it should not be on the road.

Give us some details as what your trying to get allowed on the road. I have seen some crazy drunkin mechanic work that I know I dont want driving down the same road as my family

 

[Rusted]

I am not going against you, just trying to understand where you are going exactly. Can we use you as an example?

Sounds like your vehicle is close to passing the inspection, but not quite. So you have two options right now. Option A - take the time and money and get it street legal. or Option B - register it has OHV and not drive it on the road.

The current law makes sense. If it will pass minimum standards they allow it on the public roads, if it does not meet those minimum standards then don't allow it on the road (and also pay less tax because you are not using it on the roads)

I never have done this, but I understand you can take a OHV titles vehicle and convert it back to street legal with some paper work. I would like to see that process simplified and easier to understand.

So can you explain your situation better and what part does not work for you? You want it to be on the roads even though it is missing some minumum saftey items? Maybe run it on the roads with some limited use??? IE a permit for a week that will allow you to drive it around Moab and not above a set speed limit or on a freeway?

OHV's can have windshields, what is stopping you from going OHV besides the paper work and OHV fee?

 

[Herzog]

If your vehicle cant pass then it probably should not be on the road for the safety of others. Most of us throw some fender flares on and some mudflaps and it passes if yours is so heavily modified it cant pass then it should not be on the road.

Give us some details as what your trying to get allowed on the road. I have seen some crazy drunkin mechanic work that I know I dont want driving down the same road as my family

He has currently never mentioned that he's trying to make it legal on-road... but more of a middle ground where he doesn't have to forfeit certain aspects of his vehicle in order to go full OHV license. You have to have a licensed vehicle (street or ohv) in order to tow on city / state roads or drive on public land.

I'm interested in this and where it could possibly go...

Edit- I've never heard that having an OHV license would require you to have a non-glass windshield, but I wouldn't be surprised.

 

[spaggyroe]

Ghost Crawler,

You keep using the term "we".
Are you part of an organized effort that is trying to push this through, or are you the singular point of contact?

I think it would be important to clarify where / how people can support this concept.

 

[Ghost Crawler]

My Jeep definately is not street legal nor do I want it to be. Let me explain the situation a bit better.
I had just unloaded my Jeep off of my trailer at the trailhead of Hell's REvenge, parked it, got out...and a few minutes later the Assistant Park Ranger shows up and proceeds to impound my vehicle for no license plates. It's obvious that it is not street legal, but he said that I needed registration anyways.
Another situation in Moab, my buddy was approached by a Sherriff and his rig was impounded for having a license plate. Because it was obvious taht he obtained it illegally...there was no way his rig was going to pass state inspection. This is why I decided not to register my rig.
You do have to remove your windshield to have an OHV permit, remove passenger seats, and surrender your VIN, which is impossible to get back.

DO YOU SEE THE PROBLEM?

There is no law in Utah for these type of vehicle. The law is so vague, that it is basically up to the officer's discretion what they decide to do.

I have contacted several agencies about this situation in the past few days and no one has an answer, except to get a law put into place- that hasn't been written yet.

My main purpose for this post it to gain the support of other fully modified jeeper's to get something like this passed. And to see if there have been any other similar situations out there.

 

[1993yj]

Edit- I've never heard that having an OHV license would require you to have a non-glass windshield, but I wouldn't be surprised.

I never have done this, but I understand you can take a OHV titles vehicle and convert it back to street legal with some paper work. I would like to see that process simplified and easier to understand.

So can you explain your situation better and what part does not work for you? You want it to be on the roads even though it is missing some minumum saftey items? Maybe run it on the roads with some limited use??? IE a permit for a week that will allow you to drive it around Moab and not above a set speed limit or on a freeway?

OHV's can have windshields, what is stopping you from going OHV besides the paper work and OHV fee?

The windshield part is not true. I know plenty of vehicles licensed OHV that have glass windshields. I think that surrendering the VIN may be an issue, but my brother bought a rig that was registered OHV (still had a glass windshield), still had the original VIN in place, and re-registered it on-road. I don't remember the entire procedure, but it was something like get it road worthy, take it to the DMV, they come out and look at it and say yea or nay, and give you a new VIN if necessary. I don't remember if he had to get an inspection before or after the DMV, although he may have been there more than once. Since he was not the one who originally registered it OHV, I don't know how the VIN was still on there.

As for changing the laws as they are now, I would be in favor of trying to get our laws to be more like Colorado's. I doubt it will even happen though. Too many cops always give me the "I hate getting rock chips from guys with big tires" line. I personally have never had an issue with that, just from haul trucks with uncovered loads, but that opens up a whole new can of worms.

 

[Ghost Crawler]

Herzog,
Looks like your rig isn't street legal. What do you do?

 

[1993yj]

You do have to remove your windshield to have an OHV permit, remove passenger seats, and surrender your VIN, which is impossible to get back.

DO YOU SEE THE PROBLEM?

There is no law in Utah for these type of vehicle. The law is so vague, that it is basically up to the officer's discretion what they decide to do.

I have contacted several agencies about this situation in the past few days and no one has an answer, except to get a law put into place- that hasn't been written yet.

My main purpose for this post it to gain the support of other fully modified jeeper's to get something like this passed. And to see if there have been any other similar situations out there.

I see many problems here.

1. You chose to break a law and are upset with the consequences. Not registering it either way will obviously get you impounded.

2. You are misinformed about what it takes to get your rig registered OHV. This is most likely because no one at the State really knows the law themselves.

3. I am all about supporting something, but at this point, there seems to be no real direction going here. If there were more of a definite direction that you were thinking of taking with this law, I think that you would get a lot of support here, myself included.

If you get a draft put together and then post it up for input I think that things would move much smoother than where we are at right now. I still like the idea of looking at CO's laws and trying to adapt from there, but I think it will be a long and costly process, if it ever goes through.

 

[spaggyroe]

You do have to remove your windshield to have an OHV permit, remove passenger seats, and surrender your VIN, which is impossible to get back.

A few points to discuss here.
-I've seen many OHV licensed vehicles with windshields.
-You need a VIN to license a vehicle as an OHV, so if the original VIN is not used the DMV will issue a new one. My friends cruiser was issued a new VIN when he licensed it as an OHV.
- remove passenger seats? I'm not buying that one. If you couldn't have passengers in an OHV, all of the new "side by side" ATV's such as the yamaha rhino, etc, wouldn't be licensable (is that a real word)???

Show us a link or document that outlines the requirements of an OHV.
I'd like to separate fact from propaganda.

 

[Spork]

This may be helpful here...


http://rockymountainextreme.com/showthread.php?t=29487&highlight=ohv+register

 

[Meat_]

...You do have to remove your windshield to have an OHV permit, remove passenger seats, which is impossible to get back...

Wrong on all accounts. The only two things you give up are your VIN and title.

 

[spaggyroe]

This may be helpful here...


http://rockymountainextreme.com/showthread.php?t=29487&highlight=ohv+register

Thanks Spork

 

[Rusted]

My Jeep definately is not street legal nor do I want it to be. Let me explain the situation a bit better.
I had just unloaded my Jeep off of my trailer at the trailhead of Hell's REvenge, parked it, got out...and a few minutes later the Assistant Park Ranger shows up and proceeds to impound my vehicle for no license plates. It's obvious that it is not street legal, but he said that I needed registration anyways.
Another situation in Moab, my buddy was approached by a Sherriff and his rig was impounded for having a license plate. Because it was obvious taht he obtained it illegally...there was no way his rig was going to pass state inspection. This is why I decided not to register my rig.
You do have to remove your windshield to have an OHV permit, remove passenger seats, and surrender your VIN, which is impossible to get back.

DO YOU SEE THE PROBLEM?

There is no law in Utah for these type of vehicle. The law is so vague, that it is basically up to the officer's discretion what they decide to do.

I have contacted several agencies about this situation in the past few days and no one has an answer, except to get a law put into place- that hasn't been written yet.

My main purpose for this post it to gain the support of other fully modified jeeper's to get something like this passed. And to see if there have been any other similar situations out there.

In your situation a standard OHV should satisfy all your needs. You never want to drive on the street, you don't want that. But like the officer said you need to pay the registration fee and get a sticker (just like the motorcycles, 4-wheelers, etc do). No plates are needed, just the yearly OHV fee. No inspection, none of that. You can have multiple seats and passengers, windshields, etc. You are simply a Class II vehicle at that point. What law would you want different than the current law in your case? Here is a link to more info and laws.

http://stateparks.utah.gov/docs/ohv.pdf


Your buddy is a little different case. Sounds like he is street legal, and passed inspection (and I assume that his registration is current). After it passes he is still responsible to keep the rig legal, and if not the ticket book comes out. He is required to keep it registered and plates are required as well. And in turn he gets the right of driving it on the road. I am guessing there is more to the story or he was extreme to have it impounded rather than a ticket for the reasons it did not pass inspection any more. Mud flap or fender flare tickets happen often. That is what would normally happen I would guess. What is the rest of his experience?


As I understand it Colorado and Arizona (are there others?) have more open laws pertaining to modified rigs. Is there any sort of minimum safety inspection in those states? Or is the law set so that OHV can still be driven on the pavement?

 

[Maverick]

I never have done this, but I understand you can take a OHV titles vehicle and convert it back to street legal with some paper work. I would like to see that process simplified and easier to understand.

This is where you need to focus your efforts if you're not ready to accept that you have a non-street legal buggy.

Otherwise, the state has looked at making OHV's legal on some state roads in some circumstances...maybe you can get involved in that process and add the amendment to suit your purposes. Actually, this is where you want to focus your efforts, so that you can drive your junk to and from the trailhead. Flashing lights, flag, blah blah blah and I bet it would have a chance. If you are serious about this, PM me for my number and let's talk.

I was heavily involved in the passage of the improved lift law in '00-'01 so I have a pretty good idea of what will fly and what won't. A "make buggy's have different rules" law won't fly.

Reading through the entire thread, there is some really good advice here and I don't know if a new law is necessary, but a small amendment to an existing law is certainly possible.

 

[1993yj]

I was heavily involved in the passage of the improved lift law in '00-'01 so I have a pretty good idea of what will fly and what won't. A "make buggy's have different rules" law won't fly.

Reading through the entire thread, there is some really good advice here and I don't know if a new law is necessary, but a small amendment to an existing law is certainly possible.

I would really like to see what we could get ammended again to have laws more like CO, AZ, NV, ID, etc. I am sure that there must be some states that are stricter than ours, but I have yet to see them. I think this thread brings up a good point of needing the laws changed again, just to what degree though is the question. Adding a new law is probably needless, but for on-road rigs some changes would be nice. It used to be that you only had to have fender flares if your tires stuck out more than 2", now they cannot stick out at all. The only bad thing that I have ever seen from tires being 2" wider is that they get your truck dirty fast. Maybe I am missing something, like all of those windshields that we break, not the dump trucks.

I would like to see the tint laws be a bit more lenient too, like maybe 35% so it actually looks like you have tinted your windows, vs. the 43% (although you can only find 50%) that it is now.

I am ok with the mud flap law because I don't see that one getting changed (but 35% sounds good to me instead of 50%), but how did we lose the fender flare law when we won on some of the lift laws?

Going back to the beginning ideas of this thread, what can we do to get the laws better? Or is there anything? If the other states are so much more lenient, why can't we do the same?

As I understand it Colorado and Arizona (are there others?) have more open laws pertaining to modified rigs. Is there any sort of minimum safety inspection in those states? Or is the law set so that OHV can still be driven on the pavement?

Idaho seems to be pretty lenient too. And I don't know about Nevada on their lift laws, but their tint laws seem to be non-existent.

 

[Maverick]

I'm not sure when it could stick out 2", nothing we wrote changed that. They may have added that to the enforcement book, but the law was already there.

I don't think the lift law needs to be amended, and would actually rather not even go there.

The point about the side by side ATV's is a good one...what works for side by sides should work for buggies. If you are going to amend the OHV law, then take a look at the one that is up in the current session and talk with USA-ALL, they have been heavily involved in it. I'd like a provision for buggies to be able to use state highways to get to and from the trailhead.