Your best practices when negotiating a salary...

[Troop92]

Hey guys. I have a few good prospects after months of searching for a new job. Both are to the point where an offer is completely possible.

I've only had one job out of college, then stayed there for 6 years. What are your best practices when negotiating a salary?

 

[Unimog]

I've always been pretty direct. Point out benefits you bring to the company, emphasizing those that are most likely to be unique to you or valued by the company. I'd always throw out the idea that you are considering a long term commitment to an organization and want to see if that is what they are looking for. This rarely involves any real commitment, verbal or otherwise - it is just a good way for them to get into your mindset of it being a big decision that could use some swaying.

 

[anderson750]

Being on the other side of the table as the owner of a company hiring people I want to know a couple of things. What are your beginning salary expectations and what are your salary goals 5 years from now. The first gives me some basis to evaluate if you qualifications justify your expectations. Keep in mind, he probably has zero knowledge of your great or lack of work ethic and this has tremendous value..... equivalent to or maybe more important then your education and work experience. For me personally, unless I know the person and have good knowledge of their work ethic, I am going to have their starting salary as low as possible and have a specific timeline of pay increase based on them proving to me that they deserve the money they feel they are worth.

 

[Spork]

My theories.

1. they have to beat my current salary/benefits. Unless current work is such a pain that you are willing to loose money to go elsewhere.
2. Bonuses/incentives may be BS they make up. I worked at a certain company in Lehi and when I was hired they said they did 4 quarterly bonuses and 2 performance bonuses a year. Worked there 3 years, saw 1 bonus the entire time.
3. What is the average raise? Does the average person get the raise? I'm going to come right out and say it, if a 0.5% raise is your manager's idea of a raise you're better off going elsewhere. Companies may say they are going through a rough year, market is down, etc, etc. If you're expected to skip a raise this year are they offering more when you have a child? Kid needs Braces? Dog goes to the vet? Car breaks down? If you are expected to feel their pain do they feel yours?

 

[anderson750]

My theories.

1. they have to beat my current salary/benefits. Unless current work is such a pain that you are willing to loose money to go elsewhere.
2. Bonuses/incentives may be BS they make up. I worked at a certain company in Lehi and when I was hired they said they did 4 quarterly bonuses and 2 performance bonuses a year. Worked there 3 years, saw 1 bonus the entire time.
3. What is the average raise? Does the average person get the raise? I'm going to come right out and say it, if a 0.5% raise is your manager's idea of a raise you're better off going elsewhere. Companies may say they are going through a rough year, market is down, etc, etc. If you're expected to skip a raise this year are they offering more when you have a child? Kid needs Braces? Dog goes to the vet? Car breaks down? If you are expected to feel their pain do they feel yours?

I am not trying to start a pissing match, so don't take this wrong, but I find humor in this. As the owner of a company, my wife and I took a raise for the first time in ten years last October. I have paid for braces, doctor bills, vet bills, etc on the same pay as I was getting in 2008. I am not trying to say that there are not companies out there that would lie to not have to give a raise to employee's but as an owner, I know I cannot expect payroll to increase beyond what our budget allows. When you look at your paycheck and see that you have had $1,000 in taxes taken out, keep in mind that your employer has had to match almost that amount in the employer portion.

Bottom line as an employer, I cannot justify giving somebody a raise just because another year has passed and their cost of living has gone up. Unless they are continuing to contribute to the growth of the company whether it is slow or fast during good or bad times, they are not ENTITLED to anything besides the paycheck they earn. I have never been upset with somebody who has left my employment for a better opportunity or better pay, however, I have been very happy when employee's who have left that feel they are entitled to whatever they feel is justified.

 

[Spork]

I am not trying to start a pissing match, so don't take this wrong, but I find humor in this. As the owner of a company, my wife and I took a raise for the first time in ten years last October. I have paid for braces, doctor bills, vet bills, etc on the same pay as I was getting in 2008. I am not trying to say that there are not companies out there that would lie to not have to give a raise to employee's but as an owner, I know I cannot expect payroll to increase beyond what our budget allows. When you look at your paycheck and see that you have had $1,000 in taxes taken out, keep in mind that your employer has had to match almost that amount in the employer portion.

Bottom line as an employer, I cannot justify giving somebody a raise just because another year has passed and their cost of living has gone up. Unless they are continuing to contribute to the growth of the company whether it is slow or fast during good or bad times, they are not ENTITLED to anything besides the paycheck they earn. I have never been upset with somebody who has left my employment for a better opportunity or better pay, however, I have been very happy when employee's who have left that feel they are entitled to whatever they feel is justified.

Companies can justify whatever they want for raises. If I have a positive review every year and everyone tells me I'm doing a great job and they don't know how they would get along without me and I find out the guy you just hired is making 20% more than me then there is something wrong. You don't have to provide a raise and I don't have to work here, the new hire pay difference is enough to tell more than the reviews ever did. I'm not entitled to anything, I also do not have to stay at a company. You have a right as a business owner to reduce costs and I have a right as an employee to maximize pay. I've worked at companies that I thought the work was interesting, got along fine, but at the end of the day the mortgage needed to be paid.

 

[gijohn40]

first you need to research the company and see what they are offering pay wise... next look and see what that position is paying across the state. then you need to decide what you need to be comfortable. If you feel that you need a job then maybe you can negotiate starting at a lower rate and if they feel you are what they need then they will give you a raise 3-6 months down the road at a certain amount.

If you research what the average pay is for that job around the state you can pretty much base your rate on that.

 

[anderson750]

If I have a positive review every year and everyone tells me I'm doing a great job and they don't know how they would get along without me and I find out the guy you just hired is making 20% more than me then there is something wrong.

If this is happening, then I agree 100% there is a problem. I once hired somebody to do a job comparable to another employee. The new hire was given a salary comparable to the current salary of an existing employee that had been with me for a few years. She had not had a raise in 2 years due to overall economics. If there is anything I am absolutely sure of, is that employee's talk about pay. Because of this, I knew that an employee I valued would be hurt and lost due to that and they were given a raise and all was good and I still have the initial long term employee.

As an employer, every employee is valuable to me and I treat them that way, but on the other side of the coin, no employee is ever irreplaceable.

 

[Caleb]

I'm currently kind of on the other side of the coin as well. I do a lot of hiring between all my teams. I've only ever had one person negotiate with an offered salary. I usually know what they are expecting going in to the first interview. I will rarely ever offer their asking price, I usually try to offer $5-10K above their asking...sometimes more. I want them to know that if I'm offering them a position, it's because I want them working for me, I won't ever settle for someone. I know what the guys on my teams should be making for their positions and experience and I push hard to make sure they are at or above market, even if that means forgoing a raise myself. I never want someone to leave because of money, there may be other reasons but one of the few things I can control is money.

I agree, no employee is irreplaceable, however some guys it might take multiple people to replace them with their knowledge, etc and I've never had anyone come up to speed 100% in less than 6 months. So there's more cost to hiring than just their salary.

As for negotiating, I agree mostly with what's been said. Know what you're worth in that position. Be reasonable and be able to explain why you feel you're worth that.

 

[Kiel]

I was able to negotiate a slight raise over what they offered. I was also able to go from no vacation the first year to 2 weeks earned the first year pro rated as I went. Its all about how you ask and how you sell it.

 

[johngottfredson]

Know what you are worth (and expect it) but also know what you are not worth. It comes across poorly when good candidates I have interviewed expect more than what the market would bear.

 

[Troop92]

Thanks, guys. I appreciate all the feedback, on both sides of the issue. Having been unemployed nearly two months, I'm just trying to get myself into the best situation for my family.

 

[sawtooth4x4]

I usually ask for more than I make. Unless I hate the current place I'm at. Then I'd walk for the same salary.

 

[Marsh99]

I just went though getting a new job and had to figure this out myself. The hardest part I had was my new employer was offering great benefits of paying my total health care premiums for my family plan. I ended up taking less money then I wanted but not paying for health care premiums was a great bounus. Also my new starting wage was almost 15% high then the job I was leaving so it was a win win for me.

 

[JL Rockies]

I've largely worked on performance-based income which has given me the opportunity to write my own raises.
I've also found that being the #1 guy in the company goes a long way towards asking for stuff.

When I had to move back to FL I took an entry-level job because moving to FL with a job is better than moving then trying to find something. Within 3 months, I was promoted to dept head. After two years of record-breaking profits, I was invited to lunch with the COO because I asked for a raise in salary.

Yada, yada I laid out plans for a new division of which I will run effective 2/1/16 with a 1 year guaranteed salary.

On the flip side, our least producing guy at another location demanded a 50% raise because he couldn't afford his rent. He was fired.

If you want more money, take on more responsibility, and make more money for the boss. A company can't afford to pay you if you're not generating profit.




Utah Bureau of Awesomeness Department.

 

[UNSTUCK]

I wish my position was as straight forward as some of you guys'. My official title is "Maintenance Manager". They call me the CPS, "Chief Problem Solver". I don't really have a job description. Just fix whatever problem the company has. I'd like to think I do a pretty good job of it too. I look on monster and KSL Jobs once a week or so to see what's going on. The companies that post salaries, are usually significantly lower than what I make. That makes it hard for me to know what I'm worth and then to justify to that to another company would be even harder. I've been with my company over 3 years and feel like I'm very flat, like I'm not progressing. I manage myself, and not a team, so I'm not really getting management experience which I know is hurting me. And because I'm in maintenance its not an easy jump to a different management position within the company, such as production or sales, as I know nothing about them.

A company can't afford to pay you if you're not generating profit.

I always smile at these comments. I spend many, many times my salary annually each year purchasing stuff. I'm a huge "cost" to the company each year. In the end, those cost save the company lots of money over outsourcing everything I do. So I guess I do generate profit, by not causing greater loss.

 

[mbryson]

......



I always smile at these comments. I spend many, many times my salary annually each year purchasing stuff. I'm a huge "cost" to the company each year. In the end, those cost save the company lots of money over outsourcing everything I do. So I guess I do generate profit, by not causing greater loss.

if you can quantify that data into a measurable and compare it year to year or quarter to quarter (whatever makes sense to the business) you can use that to monitor your performance.

 

[Troop92]

Excellent comments, all.

I feel that I have a realistic view of what I'm worth, even with my last job being fluid. What I was hired on to do quickly evolved in to what I had to do. It finally culminated with doing the responsibilities my boss should have done but was too incompetent to do. He made 3x what I made, but I know that isn't my worth. I'm not that brazen.

I have a killer work ethic, have since I learned how to farm when I was 10. You go to work to work. Period. I want a lasting career, I don't flit around. I stayed 6 years at my last job on promises of potential, upward movement... heck, even if I hadn't been cut, I would have stayed if there had been reasonable trust, expectations, and compensation.

At this point, finding a salary equal to what I was making before would be good. Not ideal, but better than unemployed. Haven't been unemployed since I was 15. I don't like it.

 

[Houndoc]

I just went though getting a new job and had to figure this out myself. The hardest part I had was my new employer was offering great benefits of paying my total health care premiums for my family plan. I ended up taking less money then I wanted but not paying for health care premiums was a great bounus. Also my new starting wage was almost 15% high then the job I was leaving so it was a win win for me.

This is a great point! Look beyond just the hourly/monthly pay and see what else they have to offer. This is especially true when it comes to 'raises'.

I offer my employees a match of up to 3% of their pay into a 401(k) after one year employment- a guaranteed 3% raise. But very few take us up on it. Free money left on the table.

Speaking from the owner side (I haven't taken a new job in almost 20 years), it is important that employees recognize that most owners are doing the best they can for employees. This is especially true of small businesses. As owners, we took a pay cut with the Great Recession. Employees did without raises for a few years, but got raises before we restored the cut we had taken.

As far as negotiating, I agree 100% with the importance of knowing the market. I expect veterinarians to have a reasonable expectation, and also am willing to negotiate if they can show why they may be worth more than our original offer. That should show in your initial interview more so than you spelling it out in the negotiations.

I also agree that trying to get vacation, insurance or other non-cash benefits can be more easily discussed than just seeking higher pay.

 

[hoosier]

Just one more point of view from the employer. Each position is expected to bring in a certain amount of money each year. If your spot is slotted to bring in 1,000,000 each year and you earn the company 950,000 you will not be getting a raise (most likely) On the other hand if you earn the company 1,250,000 a year you should without a doubt you should be given a raise that reflects this. I am not saying that money is the only reason for a raise but it is a large part.