14 Bolt Shave Kit

[SRSCOUT]

I have been looking at the available shave kits for the GM 14 bolt. There seem to be several types. First I saw was from Barnes Offroad. Basically bolt the new armor cover on and grind away everything below the cover. The second type I found were from TMR Custom and Ballistic Fab. These you machine away the bottom and weld in a replacement 1/2" plate.

So does anyone here have hands on experience with any of these methods? If so what is your impression of the method you used ?

 

[Hickey]

I did the first method you described. It worked well, although I reused the stock diff cover (like 18 years ago).

In my opinion, having a smooth bottom is all you really need. Anything beyond that is just more work, money, and problems. The heavy duty diff cover would be the only thing I would add to what I did.

 

[SRSCOUT]

That's kind of what I was thinking. With the cut/grind method you supposedly gain 1 1/4" vs 2" for the full machine and plate in version. Not really sure the 3/4 " is worth all the extra labor involved.

 

[mbryson]

I have the 1.25-1.5" clearance you mention. Not a fan of the cut/weld- machine the ring gear deal. To me, one of the cool aspects of the 14 bolt is it's ultimate availability. Cutting it all up makes things more difficult if something were to go wrong.

 

[SRSCOUT]

OK so I got the 14 bolt home and sitting on the jack stands----- HOLY CRAP, IT'S HUGE!!!!!!. Had a Dana 60FF sitting next to it and a Ford 9 inch in the corner. Makes both of them look like a joke. First time I have been around a 14 bolt (it was given to me so I.m not out any $$$). So I'm wondering. Plan's are to run a full width 44 front (nope, I don't have a 60 and they are big $$) and 35" tires. Max I would ever go to with this rig is 37's. So do I really need the 14 bolt with max of 37" tires? I do run a heavier rig (75 Scout II) with a TBI Chev. Currently running a SM465 4spd and a 205 case, but have most of the parts together for a TH350/203/205 ORD Doubler.
It looks like the 14 bolt is going to be a MAJOR ground clearance killer. The 9" is a 31 spline with the big bearings from a 78 F150. Looks like even if I shave the 14 bolt the 9" is going to have alot more clearance. So with all this in mind would I be better off swapping in the 9" and setting up the 44 as a 5 X 5 1/2 pattern as I have the Ford rotors and did this conversion in an earlier incarnation of the Scout so I can do it quite easily so it would match the 9" rear, or just go with the 14 bolt, grind it as much as possible and live with the reduced clearance?

 

[Hickey]

The nice thing about a 14 bolt versus a 9 inch, is you can bash the ever lovin crap outta that 14 bolt, and not think twice about it. The 9 inch will probably live, but you will never kill that 14 bolt. Never.

 

[Jinx]

The nice thing about a 14 bolt versus a 9 inch, is you can bash the ever lovin crap outta that 14 bolt, and not think twice about it. The 9 inch will probably live, but you will never kill that 14 bolt. Never.

Ditto.

14 bolt. All but bullet proof, lots of parts around. Easy to work on.

I have been running a 14 bolt since 2002 with 40's and V8 on a HEAVY rig. (Knock on wood). No worries. Heck I haven't bother to shave mine yet.

 

[SRSCOUT]

Yea the 14 is built like a brick crap house for sure. Only thing I worry about is on 35's will I be dragging it everywhere I go. I do have the 31 spline big bearing 9" I could use. It would have a lot more clearance. When I was running standard width on my Scout I had 44's front and rear ( they seemed to have good clearance) and ran 35's , but recently I watched some old video I have of a trip we did to Moab and noticed the times I drug the diff on Rusty Nail/ Gold Bar Rim and I'm afraid that with the 14 it would be a lot worse. I'm also concerned that with the doubler things are going to get a little harder on drive train components, especially the rear. I think the front 44 will hold up (Have good shafts/joints) even with the locker.
Hard decision.

 

[SRSCOUT]

Ditto.

14 bolt. All but bullet proof, lots of parts around. Easy to work on.

I have been running a 14 bolt since 2002 with 40's and V8 on a HEAVY rig. (Knock on wood). No worries. Heck I haven't bother to shave mine yet.

Are you running stock 30 spline shafts, or hardened 35 spline?

 

[mbryson]

Are you running stock 30 spline shafts, or hardened 35 spline?

I'm running stock 14 bolt everything. I just cut 1"-ish off the lip on the bottom and smoothed everything up to the little pockets on the side.

 

[SRSCOUT]

What size tires do you run on the Wrangler with the 14 in it?

 

[Jinx]

Are you running stock 30 spline shafts, or hardened 35 spline?

Stock 30 spline 14 bolt with 4:56s and a Detroit.

I see your concern about clearance, but in my head I am wondering how many times you want to build this. The 9" is a great axle, sure you can do 35 spline shafts and truss it, but at the end of the day it's still a 9".

Cut the lip off the 14 bolt before you put it in and don't look back.

Unless you are a competition driver who can't take a back up without losing points it really doesn't matter. I would rather take a back up lose 30 seconds of my wheeling day than blow a 31" spline axle and lose a day or more.

Just food for thought.

 

[mbryson]

What size tires do you run on the Wrangler with the 14 in it?

I've run 40" for a couple years an have run 38" for about 6 years now

 

[thenag]

Wow it's been about 15 years since we had the Large Gathering of Broncos in Moab... but...

We had about 20 full size rigs, almost all full size broncos almost all with 1 ton axles. I had the smallest tires (35's). There were 3 broken rear axle shafts all were stock 30 spline dana 60's. No one broke a 14 bolt or a sterling 10.25. The guys with the 30 spline d60 rears carried extra axle shafts. I doubt anyone with a 14 bolt carries extra axle shafts.

Don't get me wrong a rear d60 can be upgraded to be as strong or stronger than a 14 bolt, but it cost money to make a rear 60 strong. And rear d70's can be found for fairly cheap too.

I wanted a 14 bolt because I knew that it is pretty damn impossible to brake anything on it, it has the extra pinion support bearing (which I guess the ford 9 has as well), disk brake conversions are easy (which ditches the really heavy drums) a Detroit is practically a lunch box locker, cheap and can be installed without a carrier change(at the time I paid $400 for my detroit, new), a 14 bolt is also one of the easiest axles to re-gear.

The 14 bolt can also be narrowed 4 inches just by installed hubs from a dually axle. (which forces you to move the brake backing plate or install disk brakes)

So are you willing to give up the weight and ground clearance for an axle you will never break, for one that you probably won't break? Keep in mind all the other advantages of the 14 bolt.

Nathan

 

[SRSCOUT]

OK. It sounds like maybe I'm worrying about something that doesn't matter. No I'm not a competitive driver, I just enjoy more extreme trails than most do. I accepted many years ago that occasionally breaking parts was part of the game. I just don't like to break any more than necessary. I pulled the shafts from the 14 bolt this morning and they are BIG. A lot bigger than the shafts from the FF 60 I have. I can't see how under any circumstances I would ever break them. Even with stock shafts.

So on with the project I go. When I got the 14 bolt there were no drums on it (or brakes at all for that matter) so I guess now is as good a time as ever to convert to disc brakes. Is it worth buying a kit to do it, or just buy the brackets and source the rest of the parts myself? I would like a cable E Brake and I guess this is possible using calipers from a Elderado or and Olds Toranado. Just trying to figure out the best way to go.

 

[Jinx]

If you really want an E-brake. (I don't run one)

Something to think about, just because you haven't put this under a rig yet, is watching for a newer model 14 bolt with disc brakes already on it.

You can sell what you have, pick up the new axle and be WAY ahead of what it would cost to do a E-brake conversion... (the are stupid expensive, or at least used to be...

 

[pkrfctr]

If you really want an E-brake. (I don't run one)

Something to think about, just because you haven't put this under a rig yet, is watching for a newer model 14 bolt with disc brakes already on it.

You can sell what you have, pick up the new axle and be WAY ahead of what it would cost to do a E-brake conversion... (the are stupid expensive, or at least used to be...

I hate to do it but have to disagree with jinx...... sorry buddy.
The current build, that I pick up next week, is a tmr shaved 14 bolt. I know a lot of the forums have bad reviews on the caddy style ebrakes but its working great on the new rig. im running a '77 eldorado caddy rear caliper with the stock jk ebrake cable. It was easier for us to make a custom lever to adapt the jk cable than it was to change cables, so thats what we did. http://www.tsmmfg.com/ sells the whole assembly but expensive. I bought cheap calipers without the levers and springs. we cut the levers out. and I bought springs from ace hardware that are almost an exact match to the factory ones (no you cant find the springs anywhere). aside from TSM and thats pricey

 

[thenag]

I hate to do it but have to disagree with jinx...... sorry buddy.
The current build, that I pick up next week, is a tmr shaved 14 bolt. I know a lot of the forums have bad reviews on the caddy style ebrakes but its working great on the new rig. im running a '77 eldorado caddy rear caliper with the stock jk ebrake cable. It was easier for us to make a custom lever to adapt the jk cable than it was to change cables, so thats what we did. http://www.tsmmfg.com/ sells the whole assembly but expensive. I bought cheap calipers without the levers and springs. we cut the levers out. and I bought springs from ace hardware that are almost an exact match to the factory ones (no you cant find the springs anywhere). aside from TSM and thats pricey

That is sweet that you got that working. A cost effective way to get functioning eldo calipers. There might be a little bit of a market for those arms.

I have the TSM big calipers (not the same ones that pkrfctr has) I paid big bucks for them and they never worked quite right. I realized that I wasn't getting enough cable pull, I made a quick little bracket and the parking brake works pretty sweet. I know you said you have a manual (like me) so a reliable parking brake is almost required.

here is the post on what I did to get my eldo calipers working well. Also I made my own cables and ran them for years. found junk yard cables that were too long, cut them down and crimped and welded a used cable end on the end. I recently had Six States make some cables using my homemade ones for size.

https://www.rme4x4.com/showthread.p...-XJ-Build-up&p=1075657&viewfull=1#post1075657

My parking brake works really well, as well as a drum in hat style, no not quite, but it is simple and works well enough.

I got my disk brake brakes from Ruff Stuff

Also look into the pirate4x4 14 bolt bible for info on the axle

Nathan

 

[SRSCOUT]

Thenag so I read your linked post. Is going with the cable E Brake as big a pain as it sounds like? I would really like to have one as I'm running a 4spd for now.

 

[skippy]

I have a 9inch in the back of the my CJ7 on 35s and I break it if I look at it funny... definately go with the 14 bolt or some other full floating axle