3/4 ton Chevy under my CJ-5

[chadr]

Hey Guys. I need your opinion.

I have a 1963 Jeep CJ-5 with a 350 chevy mated to the stock T-90 Transmissison and Dana 18 t-case. The stock narrow track Dana 44 front and rear axles are all still installed.

I have access to the Transmission and transfer case and axles from a 1977 Chevy 3/4 ton. From what I see, The engine is offset to the drivers side with the current setup, and I would have to shift it back to the center of the rig. I know that I will have some driveline modifications along with some other unforseen problems, but I would like to get some input on other problems that might arise before I start to tear her apart. This will be my first go at a major reconstruction and I would like te get a little bit of inside information before I start.

Any Suggestions? Thanks.

 

[Jinx]

Hey Guys. I need your opinion.

I have a 1963 Jeep CJ-5 with a 350 chevy mated to the stock T-90 Transmissison and Dana 18 t-case. The stock narrow track Dana 44 front and rear axles are all still installed.

I have access to the Transmission and transfer case and axles from a 1977 Chevy 3/4 ton. From what I see, The engine is offset to the drivers side with the current setup, and I would have to shift it back to the center of the rig. I know that I will have some driveline modifications along with some other unforseen problems, but I would like to get some input on other problems that might arise before I start to tear her apart. This will be my first go at a major reconstruction and I would like te get a little bit of inside information before I start.

Any Suggestions? Thanks.

First thing, a stock 1963 CJ 5 should have a Dana 27 front closed knuckle and offset dana 44 rear. It seems like your wheel base is around 80 inches. Is this right? I don't want to assume anything?

Second, by saying 77 chev 3/4 ton I would guess it 465 4 speed and a 205 t-case. Is that right?

On general terms, one thing you have to consider is drive line length and angle, especially the rear. The longer the drive train the shorter and steeper the rear driveline gets.

You will want to measure your current set up from the front of the belhousing to the rear yoke on the t case and then do the same for the donor, see if you can physically get it to fit. Lengthwise.

 

[I Lean]

First thing, a stock 1963 CJ 5 should have a Dana 27 front closed knuckle and offset dana 44 rear. It seems like your wheel base is around 80 inches. Is this right? I don't want to assume anything?

Second, by saying 77 chev 3/4 ton I would guess it 465 4 speed and a 205 t-case. Is that right?

On general terms, one thing you have to consider is drive line length and angle, especially the rear. The longer the drive train the shorter and steeper the rear driveline gets.

You will want to measure your current set up from the front of the belhousing to the rear yoke on the t case and then do the same for the donor, see if you can physically get it to fit. Lengthwise.

Also, with that offset output of the Tcase, the driveline angles are a LOT less steep than they would be/will be with a centered output Tcase.

That 205 will be HUGE in a '5.

I wouldn't do it unless you're planning on serious mods to the rig to make the wheelbase longer. (basically un-jeeping the rig into something pseudo-buggy-ish)

 

[Tacoma]

the 465/205 adapter is pretty long, too. Danger Will Robinson.

 

[chadr]

First thing, a stock 1963 CJ 5 should have a Dana 27 front closed knuckle and offset dana 44 rear. It seems like your wheel base is around 80 inches. Is this right? I don't want to assume anything?

Second, by saying 77 chev 3/4 ton I would guess it 465 4 speed and a 205 t-case. Is that right?

On general terms, one thing you have to consider is drive line length and angle, especially the rear. The longer the drive train the shorter and steeper the rear driveline gets.

You will want to measure your current set up from the front of the belhousing to the rear yoke on the t case and then do the same for the donor, see if you can physically get it to fit. Lengthwise.

I think that the Front is a dana 44 not a 27. It is closed knuckle and offset to the passenger side, but I might be wrong. It might have been modified and scavanged from a different vehicle. It also has 11 inch hydraulic brakes which isn't what a stock 63 had either.

The rear is centered and I think that it is a dana 44 also. The wheelbase is right around 82 inches from my measurements. When I purchased new brake shoes for both axles, the shoes matched a J-10 pickup, but I didn't think that a J-10 had narrow track axles.

The donor vehicle has the 465 four speed and 205 t-case. I need to measure it up and see what the overall length is from bell housing to end of t-case, but I thought that it would be semi close to the same length as the setup that I have now due to the 465 being 12 inches long. I don't know how long the 205 setup is. I figured that I would have to modify driveline lengths, but I don't know if the 205 will have problems fitting between the frame rails. Any help on that one?

If this is getting too difficult to make it happen, I was considering keeping the Jeep dana 18 t-case and adapting it to the 465. Novak had a kit for this for about $500.00 and that way I could keep my engine in the same place and not have to modify the axle setup. I think that the next step would be to find some grand wagoneer axles with the same offsets that are the wide track and then put them under the rig. It would probably save me in the long run. The only reason I had this idea about the chevy drivetrain is because I could get them for cheap.

Any further suggestions?

 

[Floppy Hat]

The rear is centered and I think that it is a dana 44 also. The wheelbase is right around 82 inches from my measurements. When I purchased new brake shoes for both axles, the shoes matched a J-10 pickup, but I didn't think that a J-10 had narrow track axles.

If this is getting too difficult to make it happen, I was considering keeping the Jeep dana 18 t-case and adapting it to the 465.

Any further suggestions?

If the rear is centered than it is not the original axle. All vehicles that came with a Dana 18 had a rear axle offset to the passenger side to match the offset output of the Dana 18.

As far as using the Novak kit to adapt the 465 to the Dana 18, check on the length of the adapter, as that may rob you of valuable rear driveline length.

 

[chadr]

If the rear is centered than it is not the original axle. All vehicles that came with a Dana 18 had a rear axle offset to the passenger side to match the offset output of the Dana 18.

As far as using the Novak kit to adapt the 465 to the Dana 18, check on the length of the adapter, as that may rob you of valuable rear driveline length.

According to the site, the adaptor is only an inch long making the transmission and transfer case only 13 inches long. I don't think that it would be too bad, but I will have to see what the length of my setup is right now. Here is the site for those of you doing homework.
http://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/kit_462.htm

 

[I Lean]

Do you really have a Dana 18 still? If they swapped to a centered-diff rear axle, they may have changed the Tcase also.

 

[chadr]

Do you really have a Dana 18 still? If they swapped to a centered-diff rear axle, they may have changed the Tcase also.

I will try to post some pics tomorrow and maybe you guys can help me figure out what I have. I might be wrong being the novice that i am and taking in what the shadetree neighbors say that have worked on it with me.

 

[Jinx]

According to the site, the adaptor is only an inch long making the transmission and transfer case only 13 inches long. I don't think that it would be too bad, but I will have to see what the length of my setup is right now. Here is the site for those of you doing homework.
http://www.novak-adapt.com/catalog/kit_462.htm

Cool site, but you might have miss read, the trany is 12" plus 1" for the adapter for a total of 13" this does not include the t-case.

Keep us informed on your project...

 

[chadr]

Cool site, but you might have miss read, the trany is 12" plus 1" for the adapter for a total of 13" this does not include the t-case.

Keep us informed on your project...

Does anyone know what length a stock Chevy bell housing runs? I read the lengths of the 465 on the site and I know that I am probably going to be 4 inches longer with the transmission and adapter plate if I convert to the chevy. Right now, I have an adaptor plate (don't know what make) that adapts the block to the stock Jeep bell housing and transmission. I don't know if they had to extend the input shaft to make this setup work or not, but the adaptor plate is about an inch thick which would be removed and give me back an inch to play with. I will have to get some measurments on the existing transfer cast to see what overall length it will be. That way I can see if the drivelines are going to be too short in the rear. I also have the problem with the pto winch output that comes out of the t-case. I will probably have to modify it or get rid of the PTO and go with a overdrive or something.

I can tell that I need to do some more homework on this. I will try to post some pics for you guys to help me decifer if I am wrong on my equipment.

Thanks for your help.

 

[Shawn]

Does anyone know what length a stock Chevy bell housing runs? .

6"

 

[chadr]

I went out and looked at a few things last night after I got home from work and now I think that you guys are right. The Rear axle is offset to the passenger side like you said. I think it is a Dana 44 from what I can tell from pictures that I have seen. If I could figure out how to post pictures, I would post them. The rear drive line is about 24 inches long right now. I think that I could go a little bit shorter and probably be o.k. I might even put a CV on it. The front driveline is really long. It looks like it is closer to 36 inches long.
PM me with an email address and I will send you some pictures of what I took last night. Either that or email me at chadr@sginet.com and I will reply with the pics.

I think that if I go through with it, I will probably see if I can mate the 465 to the Existing T-case and then find me some wide track Grand Wagoneer Axles or Scout Axles. I have heard that they are the same setup as what I have now, but need to modify the Spring Hangers in the front to fit the pumpkin next to the springs. The rear has to just relocate the spring perches.

My wife said that she wants me to sell this project and get something newer that I didn't have to work on so much. I just don't think that I can sell one of the kids.

 

[Shawn]

metaltech@rockymountainextreme.com

I can post them for you when I get home from work.

 

[Floppy Hat]

From what you have said (PTO, rear offset to the passenger side) it sounds like you do have a Dana 18.

If you do go any shorter than 24" on the rear driveline, I would encourage you to go with a CV joint.

Your wife's advice might not be that bad. Before you get too far into this you may want to stop and look at what your goals are for this vehicle (Exteme wheeler, mild wheeler/daily driver, family exploring rig, etc.) and evaluate if this is the best starting point.

 

[Shawn]

ps,

I have a set of Dana 44 axles off of a cherokee with the offset rear. Let me know.

 

[chadr]

ps,

I have a set of Dana 44 axles off of a cherokee with the offset rear. Let me know.

What width are they? What gears? Brakes? How much for them?

Thanks

 

[Shawn]

What width are they? What gears? Brakes? How much for them?

Thanks

hummm... I wan't to say 62", 3:73, yep they have brakes... Disk in the front drum in the rear. Stock, but complete.

PM me an offer.

 

[chadr]

From what you have said (PTO, rear offset to the passenger side) it sounds like you do have a Dana 18.

If you do go any shorter than 24" on the rear driveline, I would encourage you to go with a CV joint.

Your wife's advice might not be that bad. Before you get too far into this you may want to stop and look at what your goals are for this vehicle (Exteme wheeler, mild wheeler/daily driver, family exploring rig, etc.) and evaluate if this is the best starting point.

I don't want to go extreme wheeler out of it, but I would like to keep as a mild wheeler and daily driver. The wheelbase is just not long enough to make it an extreme wheeler unless I do major reconstructive surgery on it. I would just like to make it a wide track because I have tipped it over going 25 mph down a dirt road and It probably wouldn't have tipped if it was wider. I like the thought of the 465 because I feel it will stand up to the torque of the V8 better. It needs a bunch of work, but I will have to see if it is worth it or not.
Thanks for all of your help.

 

[Floppy Hat]

Sounds like a fun project!

Buy Shawn's axles, get a little wider fender flare, and have fun with it.