AFC Run Report - 4Wheeler Recovery

[Bart]

Sounds like a great recovery. You know you can always call if you need help (didn't look like you did). I jump at almost any excuse to leave work and head up to a recovery. Bummer about the moose and atv riders.

 

[Cherokeester]

Good work Kurt, I pulled an ATV and the rider out of that river once. He was pretty lucky we came by. He threw his shoe at my Jeep in a desperate attempt to get my attention. I pulled him out then his machine. It was pretty hard because of the heavy runoff.

 

[NE_Utah]

I need to get that going out here. I just do not have the backing. All everyone likes to do is "goen diggen cus they just got new mudders:sick:"

I have met a few people that like to crawl:tara:

 

[Meat_]

How many ATVer would have pulled it out.

Me. Shawn. Badger. Hell I bet even James K would. Many more I know would have if they could have.

It's disturbing to me to see how many people on here act toward ATV riders with the same prejudice as greenies apply to the entire 4x4 crowd.

Every group has it's bad apples, the problem with the atv crowd is that you can get a MUCH more capable ride for much less money and you can walk into a store and walk out with a new machine that will go more places stock than most of the built rigs on here, there is no time spent building your rig so there is no time spent learning the right way to do things.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

...It's disturbing to me to see how many people on here act toward ATV riders with the same prejudice as greenies apply to the entire 4x4 crowd.

Every group has it's bad apples, the problem with the atv crowd is that you can get a MUCH more capable ride for much less money and you can walk into a store and walk out with a new machine that will go more places stock than most of the built rigs on here, there is no time spent building your rig so there is no time spent learning the right way to do things.

I've thought long and hard about the subject. I honestly feel like the ATV community is the anchor holding the OHV community down. They are the largest segment, the least organized, the least represented and often the largest violators. In talking with both FS & BLM reps all over the state, they concede that the majority of their issues are with improper and illegal ATV use. Now, I fully agree that it doesn't always happen with malice in mind... there are so many variables but the major ones include the facts you mentioned. You can buy an equipped ATV so easily, children/teenagers have such open access to ATV's, you can rent an ATV more widely than a say a Jeep (Moab likely being the one exception).

I've had this conversation with alot of folks, anti-motorized users on uUtah and SLTrib, rangers in AF Canyon, several U4 BOD members, as well as alot of individuals... I honestly think that the majority of ill-will towards the OHV community is actually aimed at the ATV community, and only shed on the OHV community because we represent ourselves as a united front.

Don't get me wrong there are some excellent ATV clubs and individuals in the state, they get alot done, but it is pale in comparison to the number of un-involved users. My trips throughout this last year have really driven the point home... without fail the majority of the "damage" that I've witnessed on public lands is ATV related. Not all, but the majority.

Read through many of the anti-motorized posts on places like SLTrib or DesNews, in almost every case they aim their angst at "fat, lazy, disrespectful ATV owners", rarely will you see them call out a 4x4 or Jeep.

Its an interesting debate no doubt, I love riding ATV's, I love riding dirtbikes, but if we are going to lose more and more land at the hand of one user group... what do you do? Its a double-edged sword, no doubt... but its one that isn't likely to go away.

My example would have to be AF Canyon... Of all the repairs needed in the canyon, I would guess that 90% of them were ATV related, its obviously relative to the amount of said users in the canyon, but I don't think ATV users make up 90% of the users. Even if they did, they likely represent less than 10% of those active and advocating in service projects, etc. I don't have any hard numbers there, just my experiences in the canyon, your results may vary. I know on trails like HITR, the only visible off-trail driving was ATV users, not just one, countless tracks, they seem to thing thier seemingly lightweight machines won't be noticed off the trail?? Not sure whats running through their minds??

 

[NE_Utah]

Me. Shawn. Badger. Hell I bet even James K would. Many more I know would have if they could have.

It's disturbing to me to see how many people on here act toward ATV riders with the same prejudice as greenies apply to the entire 4x4 crowd.

Every group has it's bad apples, the problem with the atv crowd is that you can get a MUCH more capable ride for much less money and you can walk into a store and walk out with a new machine that will go more places stock than most of the built rigs on here, there is no time spent building your rig so there is no time spent learning the right way to do things.

But you don't count meat. You need your own ATV recovered at times
I ride ATVs also. Let me rephrase that. ATV only drivers. and how many of them have a cable and rope long enough to get to it.

The big poblem out here is the ATVs. We are trying to immprove but that is the number one outdoor rec vehicle here

 

[Meat_]

I've thought long and hard about the subject. I honestly feel like the ATV community is the anchor holding the OHV community down. They are the largest segment, the least organized, the least represented and often the largest violators. In talking with both FS & BLM reps all over the state, they concede that the majority of their issues are with improper and illegal ATV use. Now, I fully agree that it doesn't always happen with malice in mind... there are so many variables but the major ones include the facts you mentioned. You can buy an equipped ATV so easily, children/teenagers have such open access to ATV's, you can rent an ATV more widely than a say a Jeep (Moab likely being the one exception).

I've had this conversation with alot of folks, anti-motorized users on uUtah and SLTrib, rangers in AF Canyon, several U4 BOD members, as well as alot of individuals... I honestly think that the majority of ill-will towards the OHV community is actually aimed at the ATV community, and only shed on the OHV community because we represent ourselves as a united front.

Don't get me wrong there are some excellent ATV clubs and individuals in the state, they get alot done, but it is pale in comparison to the number of un-involved users. My trips throughout this last year have really driven the point home... without fail the majority of the "damage" that I've witnessed on public lands is ATV related. Not all, but the majority.

Read through many of the anti-motorized posts on places like SLTrib or DesNews, in almost every case they aim their angst at "fat, lazy, disrespectful ATV owners", rarely will you see them call out a 4x4 or Jeep.

Its an interesting debate no doubt, I love riding ATV's, I love riding dirtbikes, but if we are going to lose more and more land at the hand of one user group... what do you do? Its a double-edged sword, no doubt... but its one that isn't likely to go away.

My example would have to be AF Canyon... Of all the repairs needed in the canyon, I would guess that 90% of them were ATV related, its obviously relative to the amount of said users in the canyon, but I don't think ATV users make up 90% of the users. Even if they did, they likely represent less than 10% of those active and advocating in service projects, etc. I don't have any hard numbers there, just my experiences in the canyon, your results may vary...

Agreed. With the exception of your use/damage estimates. The number of atvs/built rigs up AFC is easily 8:1. While I agree that atv's leave more off trail tracks than full size, the amount of damage done by the fewer full size offenders easily balances out the damage scale.

I know on trails like HITR, the only visible off-trail driving was ATV users, not just one, countless tracks, they seem to thing thier seemingly lightweight machines won't be noticed off the trail?? Not sure whats running through their minds??

Ignorance, plain and simple. Full size use has a large problem with uninformed people, atv use has the same problem 10 fold.

...ATV only drivers. and how many of them have a cable and rope long enough to get to it.

There are VERY few atv only drivers. Almost EVERY atv you see was brought to the trail in a full size 4x4. All the stuff I've done under the U4 banner in the last few years pales in comparison to the trail work I did when I only had 4x4 tow rigs and atvs.

The big poblem out here is the ATVs. We are trying to immprove but that is the number one outdoor rec vehicle here

The point I'm trying to make here is that the problem is not atvs or full size rigs, the problem is uninformed users and we would do well to keep that in mind in our fight against the greenies.

 

[Tacoma]

The point I'm trying to make here is that the problem is not atvs or full size rigs, the problem is uninformed users and we would do well to keep that in mind in our fight against the greenies.

Well, USA-ALL wont' be helping much, since they're not really paying attention right now. It would be GREAT to have everyone involved, but......