Are we shooting ourselves in the foot?

[pokeyYJ]

I was talking to one of the guys that I work with the other day about land use issues. Now he is not real big on 4x4ing or other OHV activities, he is in fact kind of an enviromentalist when it comes down to the bottom line.

We got into a discussion about trail abuse and what was considered acceptable tear and wear. He said some things that got me thinking, so I thought that I would bring some of those concerns up on this board.

Okay, before I get any response back, I would like to say that I am going to use RS for my example because it is a widely known trail for us, I don't want the regular discussion about rock stacking or not, thats been done before.

Are we thinking enough about the future of our sport? What is to stop the enviro's from sitting back for a few years and monitoring some of the trails that we use. For ex. Rattlesnake, a trail that is in a wash, a trail that sees heavy use during the summer months, and a trail that gets used by more than just us 4x4er's. This trail has seen, what could be looked at by some, serious deterioration. What is to stop the enviromentalists from letting us control the trail for a few years and then stepping in and saying "Look at what happens when we leave you to run your own business, the trail is heavily traveled and trees and other vegetaion has been destroyed, large bolders have been pulled down blocking the natural flow of runoff. Oil and other fluids have contaiminated the ground water, and there is trash left behind by some. If you can't take care of your own trails, why should we let you take care of any public land?"

Okay, so I know it may seem a little far fetched but I think it is possible. And remember I only used Rattlesnake because it is a well known trail, the same items that I hypothetically brought up could hold true to any trail.


Lets here some thoughts on this,,,,, I may play Devil's Advocate just to get the creative juices flowing.

 

[mbryson]

Originally posted by pokeyYJ
........................I may play Devil's Advocate just to get the creative juices flowing.

Watch that devils advocate part, but I totally agree with your points. We are 'using' the land and there is no way that a vehicle will only 'leave footprints', but we should try as much as possible to only 'leave tiretracks' in PREVIOUSLY travelled areas. Widening or modifying the trail are out, IMHO. We do have every right to use the land, but we don't have ANY right to abuse it and trash it.

EVERY time I go out, I end up with junk in my rig from someone else. Sometimes it's a couple of cans, other times it's misplaced items or tools and other times it seems that someone has just decided to clean out their rig on the trail.

 

[britney]

Well if you want to get technical, weren't the pioneers the first wheelers to make a trail through imigration? hehehe


Trails happen all the time. That's just how it is. You can't make everyone happy no matter how hard you try, too many big opinions and big mouths. The best thing is to be responsible yourself and if you see an idiot leaving stuff that doesn't belong. Bash his head in with a rock!! If you care that much about the changing of trails don't wheel, hike, bike or whatever, cause your mere pressence changes the trail. I don't thing moving rocks is a big deal because they are part of that area. It's the bullet shells, cans, and car parts that piss me off. SO you just do as bryson, and clean up after the a$$holes!!

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Good point, but that is why we have service projects and trail cleanups and maintainance...

I picked up 1000's of shotgun shells at the last 5 mile pass cleanup, not to mention furniture, clothes, botles, cans... you name it.

Rattlesnake is probably the worst example to use... it is in a wasteland, mining runoff is not considered natural. American Fork Canyon is a far better example of balancing growth/use with preservation. They do a rather good job of keeping erosion down, trails clean and people happy.

Tell your hugger freind to organize a 5 Mile pass cleanup... it needs another...

 

[James K]

My thoughts are the same as most.

We need to police ourselves and others. Sometimes it is hard to confront some people either because of #'s or attitude. But we need to express in a subtle non-threatening way to these folks that there is a better more responsible way to do it without taking away from there fun.

Cleaning up is just part of it. I get people dropping crap in front of my house(3200 W. T-ville) all the time, even when I'm standing right out in front of the house. People are pigs everywhere

 

[Hickey]

Most of the arguments could be applied to I-15 too. Everytime you drive on it, it is wear. It would only be perfect if no one ever opened the wrapper, just like G.I. Joe toys. But how much use is a toy, in a box?

 

[Brett]

Originally posted by Hickey
It would only be perfect if no one ever opened the wrapper, just like G.I. Joe toys.

Don't you mean GI Jane?

 

[mbryson]

Originally posted by Brett


Don't you mean GI Jane?

That wrapper gets opened..............

 

[Hickey]

Originally posted by Brett


Don't you mean GI Jane?

hmm, new title...

 

[pokeyYJ]

Originally posted by cruiseroutfit
Rattlesnake is probably the worst example to use... it is in a wasteland, mining runoff is not considered natural. American Fork Canyon is a far better example of balancing growth/use with preservation. They do a rather good job of keeping erosion down, trails clean and people happy.

Yes Rattlesnake was probably a bad example, but it was the only one I could think of at the time.

But abusive trail behavior happens other places too, for instance Pritchett Canyon in Moab. While I have not been around long enough to notice any big changes with the trail, several other have mentioned that the trail has changed significantly since it was originally ran.

Also, isn't AF heavily monitored by the Forest Service? Is that what we are going to have to have everywhere? Are our public lands going to have to be policed by a government agency? Or do we have the ability to police ourselves and others?

What can be done to improve our image, the image that the general public sees? I don't think that telling another wheeler to pick up after him/herself is going to be enough. I think that something more drastic will have to be done to start repairing our public image. The question is,,,, what?

Do we need to start notifying the media when we have a large clean-up like the last 5-mile clean-up? Maybe some positive media attention would help. What are your thoughts?

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Originally posted by pokeyYJ
...But abusive trail behavior happens other places too, for instance Pritchett Canyon in Moab.

I can't really see anything bad about Pritchett, yes it has gaines more wear and tear but not too much... IMHO

Originally posted by pokeyYJ
I don't think that telling another wheeler to pick up after him/herself is going to be enough.

I do, if we could convince people to quit going off of designated trails and stop littering, the enviro-nazis would have no ammo.

As far as inviting the media, I'm pretty sure the media is invited to every aspect of Land-Use, wether it be clean-ups, rallies, etc... they don't always show... people would rather see a negative story that one that has a good message. Such is life.

 

[jeff788]

I'm glad to see that a lot of other people have my same concerns about land use. I drove up Providence Canyon last week for the first time. "Spur trails" and "play areas" have been created in litterally every break in the trees for the whole couple of miles before you get to the business. Not to say that it was really, really bad, it wasn't, but it is more the principle of the thing. I see this a lot at Moab. You go on a 3 rated trail and have people going off the trail to find more difficult obstacles. If you want more of a challenge, go on a harder trail instead of trying to show off on easier trails. I think that ignorance is our greatest enemy.