Car audio gurus!

[ALF]

I'm upgrading again and looking for opinions. I'm looking at these two sets of 6.5" component sets. I'm currently running RE Subs (they're super shallow and thats why I bought them) and love them so I thought of these

http://reaudio.com/components.html

these are also a little known name but a killer price

http://www.crescendoaudio.com/product.php?productid=17514&cat=251&page=1

Anyone have any experience or should I stick with the big names like Rainbow or Focal?

 

[Cody]

sound quality is relative to the ear of the listener. How do those sound to YOU compared to the Rainbow or Focal?

I've been running the JBL GTI components for a few years and really like them.

Stick with what sounds good to you, and make sure to run really good amps, wiring, and sound deadening. An ok speaker can be made to sound good with the right tuning, placement, and power, and a really expensive speaker can sound like shit with poor tuning, placement, and power.

 

[4Runner]

i totally agree with cody. and its not hard to tune speakers with a good amp either. i love MTX if you have ever looked at them. i am all about MTX. i am very big into car audio. i have 2 15s and a component set in a 4runner and it REALLY loud it is all into your pocket and what you like
http://www.mtx.com/caraudio/products/speakers/separates.cfm
these are kinda expensive but i might be able to get them a little cheaper then that. pm me if you are interested

 

[Cody]

$229 for components isn't expensive. That's barely a starting off point if you're looking for SQ.

No offense, but I can't possibly fathom 2 15's in a 4 runner that sound good either. If you're into the DB drags, cool, and I respect the engineering involved in designing a box and a system around that (standing wavelength, 1/4 wavelength, port design, charging systems etc). But don't confuse SPL or 'loud' with SQ.

I ran 1200 watts to my gti 6.5" components, and 1000 watts to 2 10's in my Dodge running off of the JBL/Crown series amps. I think it sounded good.....and I miss that stereo

Really though, it all starts at your source. A deck with hi voltage non clipping outputs is key. Without that it's really hard (from my experience) to get a lot out of any high end speakers.

 

[4Runner]

no its not alot but compared to what he is looking at it is. and like you said its all in how you set it up to get good SQ.

and im sorry but my 15s dont even push 1000 watts so how is that not good SQ. i mean if you are out side of the truck it rattles bad. but im not on the out side it has been to a logans run DB drag. i wish i could do more with comps but it gets sbendy and i would rather wheel. but it did hit 142 DB.

i dont know alot about the whole clipping thing. i know what it is and what it does(kinda) but why does that matter if your running you componet set threw a amp??? sholdn't it matter how high the output of the amp is?

 

[ALF]

I do plan on sound deadening the doors and an amp will be in the future but for now it will be just the comps and possibly new 6.5 full ranges in the rear doors. I'm running a Alpine CDA 9884 for a HU now and I like it but may upgrade it in the future. It really isn't in the budget to spend $250 plus just for the comps so i was hoping the two sets i linked to would suffice. Wish there was a local place to hear either one of them.

At $100 i guess i really can't do worse than the stockers, with the deadening material and an amp I could come in under $300

 

[ALF]

i totally agree with cody. and its not hard to tune speakers with a good amp either. i love MTX if you have ever looked at them. i am all about MTX. i am very big into car audio. i have 2 15s and a component set in a 4runner and it REALLY loud it is all into your pocket and what you like
http://www.mtx.com/caraudio/products/speakers/separates.cfm
these are kinda expensive but i might be able to get them a little cheaper then that. pm me if you are interested

I've ran LOTS of MTX stuff in the past and have never been impressed with their reliability...they sound good for a bit but never seem to hold up over time

 

[JL Rockies]

JL Audio spends more time on engineering quality components than anyone and has done more to raise the performance bar for the entire industry than any other manupackager. If you want an example of a great sounding system using 100% JL Audio components, stop by Christopher KIA in SLC and have a listen to the white KIA Soul by the front door.
You'll find the installation to be top notch as well but I digress...

 

[Cody]

no its not alot but compared to what he is looking at it is. and like you said its all in how you set it up to get good SQ.

and im sorry but my 15s dont even push 1000 watts so how is that not good SQ. i mean if you are out side of the truck it rattles bad. but im not on the out side it has been to a logans run DB drag. i wish i could do more with comps but it gets sbendy and i would rather wheel. but it did hit 142 DB.

?

your 15's don't push 1000 watts? It's not up to the subs what they push, it's the amps. Speakers really don't care how much power you send to them so long as it's clean power. I hope you don't think power is what causes a speaker to blow ha ha.

i dont know alot about the whole clipping thing. i know what it is and what it does(kinda) but why does that matter if your running you componet set threw a amp??? sholdn't it matter how high the output of the amp is

It matters MORE if you're running it through an amp lol. If you send a distorted signal to an amp, and it then AMPLIFIES it, what do you think will happen?

non clipping means the output from the deck doesn't clip--at full output it's distortion free. If you have a distortion free source, then it makes it easy to correctly set your amps. When you tune your amp you can tune at full volume so that your max output from the deck is also the max output from your amps. If your pre-outs aren't non clipping, then you basically have to guess. It's 95% as effective if done correctly, but for people looking for SQ, that 5% is exactly what makes the difference.

FYI, the gain on an amp isn't a volume adjustment, it's an adjustment to match input voltage. Incorrectly matching the gain on an amp will result in less power (OK), or an over amplified audio signal (not ok). Over amplifying the audio signal is the single most common way people blow their speakers. It's not the power that blows them, it's the distortion.

 

[4Runner]

that makes alot of sense. thank you for telling me that, you never do stop learning. it makes sense what blows a speaker to. i can see that happining. i wouldnt think im pushing any more then 1000 watts the sub is only 400 RMS. and buy the way ever sense i said it dont rattle on the in side im starting to get some in the back door. so today i have to pull it apart and fix it. damn thing

 

[Cody]

Rattles.....I have nightmares about them. I swear I've lost a year of my life manically trying to track down and fix rattles.

400 rms. This is something you should stop looking at since it means almost nothing and manufacturers arbitrarily assign those numbers. You could easily run 1000 watts to a speaker rated at 400 watts without any problems, so long as it's clean power. Just the same, you could easily blow a speaker rated at 1000 watts by sending 200 watts of shitty distorted power to it.

It sounds counterintuitive, but it's far more common and likely to blow a speaker by underpowering it than by overpowering it....all of this stuff is so interrelated and I don't know how to explain one thing without first explaining another.....so I'll just stop typing now before I write a useless novel about audio theory.

 

[4Runner]

thats ok. thank you for teaching me that. i understood the underpowering. but i didnt know that it was really that bad. well now i know

 

[ALF]

Cody...How about Alpine and hertz?

 

[Cody]

Whatever sounds good to you

I like the Alpine Type X stuff, haven't really listened to much of the Hertz speaks but I have heard good things. Honestly, I've been out of the industry for 4 years so I'm not as up to date on what is currently available.

 

[4Runner]

how about these?
http://www.fusionelectronics.com/no...r-audio-1/speakers-5/ppfr6520-45-product.aspx

 

[Cody]

how about these?
http://www.fusionelectronics.com/no...r-audio-1/speakers-5/ppfr6520-45-product.aspx

I don't know anything about them. The specs are ok, but I can make a Rampage spec sheet sound good if I wanted to.

If you're looking for a decent set of 2 way's with a crossover, the Pioneer Rev series always had a very balanced sound. Otherwise, I've been really happy with all of my JBL speakers

http://www.jbl.com/EN-US/Products/Pages/ProductDetails.aspx?PID=P662

There is a comparable 2 way.

The components I run are..

http://www.jbl.com/EN-US/Products/Pages/ProductDetails.aspx?PID=C608GTI MKII

but man, they sure were more expensive when I bought them

 

[JL Rockies]

It's not the power that blows them, it's the distortion.

This is the biggest and most prevelant myth in the audio industry. Clipping, by dramatically increasing average power over time is what destroys speakers not distortion. Distortion is high-frequency noise which is a by-product of clipping and is absorbed by the inductance of a coil in a x-over or the speaker itself. A 100 Watt amplifier driven into severe clipping will produce average power over time like a 200 Watt amp that is not driven into clipping. Either scenario would not damage a speaker thats theramally rated for 200 Watts

 

[JL Rockies]

Oh... and the only sane recommendation so far has been mine.

 

[Cody]

So if you have a 200 watt amp being over driven going into a speaker that is "rated" for 200 watts, what happens there? Distortion can be introduced in other ways as welll--shitty recording, shitty speakers, shitty deck, etc etc. My point was that no matter whether the distortion is caused by the source or as a byproduct of an audio wave clipping, over driving your amplifier is going to either cause or make it's existence worse, which isn't good for speakers.

I would still not hesitate to run 500 watts of properly adjusted power to a speaker with a RMS of 250, and I think it would both sound better and be less likely to cause harm to the speaker than 250 watts of power into a 500 rms speaker, that is from an overdriven amp or a distorted audio source.

 

[JL Rockies]

So if you have a 200 watt amp being over driven going into a speaker that is "rated" for 200 watts, what happens there? Distortion can be introduced in other ways as welll--shitty recording, shitty speakers, shitty deck, etc etc. My point was that no matter whether the distortion is caused by the source or as a byproduct of an audio wave clipping, over driving your amplifier is going to either cause or make it's existence worse, which isn't good for speakers.

I would still not hesitate to run 500 watts of properly adjusted power to a speaker with a RMS of 250, and I think it would both sound better and be less likely to cause harm to the speaker than 250 watts of power into a 500 rms speaker, that is from an overdriven amp or a distorted audio source.

If you have a 200 Watt amplifier driven into severe clipping it would produce average power over time like a 400 Watt amplifier and will most-likely cause voice coil damage to a speaker thermally rated for 200 Watts.

Distortion is distortion and it will have the same zero impact on speaker longevity. Since we have little sense of distortion with music (up to 30% of distortion is no uncommon even for a "golden-eared" audiophile) it's unlikely that no one will overdrive their amplifiers.

Since so much of music today has such a low crest factor when it's recorded, a lot of it is already "clipped" before the end user pushes "play". There's no "gain" setting that will fix that. If you were correct, you couldn't listen to anything recorded after 2000 without destroying your system.