Cummins 67a recall

[02SE]

Just a bit more on this.

Nitrogen Oxides increase as combustion chamber temperatures increase. Diesels being compression ignition, operate at higher combustion chamber temperatures than gas engines, so they naturally produce more NOx. Ways to reduce the NOx production is to run the engine at a less-lean A/F ratio, and increase the EGR. Both of which reduce combustion chamber temperatures, and fuel efficiency. You can also run more DEF through SCR to clean-up the NOx after the fact.

Maybe Cummins will just use more DEF through the SCR, and leave the engine tuning alone. If they do that, power and efficiency could be unchanged.

 

[The Rock Man]

If the change is more DEF then perhaps but time will tell and the real world data will come to light

 

[The Rock Man]

this is from Gail Banks team referencing the TFL guys doing testing for them on all of the data pre flash and post flash. pre flash data is in a video and the post flash is still coming I would guess in the next week or so

How will RAM Recall Affect Performance?​ For those not in the know, Cummins has agreed to pay $1.675 billion in a settlement to the United States Government due to accusations of emissions tampering. The Environmental Protection Agency and Department of Justice disclosed that roughly 630,000 2013-2019 Ram HD pickups were equipped with software-related emissions defeat devices. The remaining 330,000 trucks involved in the settlement, consisting of 2020-2023 Ram HD models, utilized "undisclosed engine control software features." Those equipped with the defeat devices were able to pass standard EPA emissions tests, though outside of those set conditions, they "artificially reduced the effectiveness of emissions controls." The EPA’s Office of Enforcement and Compliance Assurance attests that Cummins exposed overburdened communities across America to harmful air pollution. As part of the settlement, Cummins must repair 85% of the 2013-2019 Ram HD pickups equipped with defeat devices within three years. Stellantis and its dealers will work in collaboration with Cummins to complete a recall program which is already underway.

​

Calls are coming in daily to Banks from RAM owners who fear that the new emissions recall will negatively affect the performance of their 6.7L Cummins as well as increase DEF consumption. While we have our theories as to what the results of the recall may be, it's only a theory since neither RAM nor Cummins has shared any detailed information about the ECM updates and the potential effects thereof. Our friends at The Fast Lane Truck are testing their RAM before and after having the emissions recall. Andre Smirnov, co-host of the channel, is using a Banks iDash DataMonster to collect data from their various tests, including DEF consumption, DPF regen frequency, air temp and pressure, manifold air density, density altitude, transmission gear, engine load, and more. He'll compare the data to the same tests post-emissions recall. Watch the first installment of TFL's Cummins test.

​ WATCH VIDEO​

 

[N-Smooth]

Following since I have a ‘20.

The not passing emissions thing suuuucks!

 

[mesha]

My truck currently runs like poop. I need the ecm reflashed anyway, so I will be doing the flash. I have an appointment tomorrow.

I will let you know how it works out for me.

 

[The Rock Man]

I have some other contacts that are testing things as well. hopefully I have some more info later on today from one of them

 

[The Rock Man]

My truck currently runs like poop. I need the ecm reflashed anyway, so I will be doing the flash. I have an appointment tomorrow.

I will let you know how it works out for me.

what happened with the flash I have some partial findings ill share in a bit

 

[The Rock Man]

so let me preface what I said on another forum about my contacts findings he found that they "changed rate to empty on the def tank". how he found this is by driving the truck until the def runs out pre flash and the again post flash meaning that there will always be enough def in the tank for what fuel you have left in your main tank. that being said I went way off the rails and said the following.

"I think its a bit crazy for the EPA to mandate that kind of change at that price tag if that is all that the flash is doing. I would believe that there is more to it than adjusting rate to empty on the def tank. When I pressed the service advisor at Ram as to the details of the flash he hesitated when I asked if they were encrypting the ECM and then proceeded to go off with a bunch of "BS" about how they don't know anything etc... The EPA along with other federal agencies need to be schooled by the Supreme Court this summer and held responsible to congress before they go off and do stupid fwiw. Why should these clowns decide what is best when the answers they give are worse that what we are currently doing??"

 

[N-Smooth]

so let me preface what I said on another forum about my contacts findings he found that they "changed rate to empty on the def tank". how he found this is by driving the truck until the def runs out pre flash and the again post flash meaning that there will always be enough def in the tank for what fuel you have left in your main tank. that being said I went way off the rails and said the following.

"I think its a bit crazy for the EPA to mandate that kind of change at that price tag if that is all that the flash is doing. I would believe that there is more to it than adjusting rate to empty on the def tank. When I pressed the service advisor at Ram as to the details of the flash he hesitated when I asked if they were encrypting the ECM and then proceeded to go off with a bunch of "BS" about how they don't know anything etc... The EPA along with other federal agencies need to be schooled by the Supreme Court this summer and held responsible to congress before they go off and do stupid fwiw. Why should these clowns decide what is best when the answers they give are worse that what we are currently doing??"

So it just uses more DEF? I’m not sure I understand

 

[The Rock Man]

So it just uses more DEF? I’m not sure I understand

in theory no all they did was adjust when the def tank to say its empty when its really not, so you don't run out of def. Before you could run the truck without def basically until you shut the truck off and let the computer go to sleep and you could go your full tank distance without exhaust after treatment IE: more NOX now it will warn you that its empty before it really is so that in theory your not driving around without aftertreatment more warnings on the dash etc. you can still run it empty but if you shut the truck down it will go into limp mode when you start to go again without adding def so its really a stupid technicality that they are going after more or less which leads me to believe that they are up to something more since the fine was 2billion for a stupid reason just saying I think the overall goal is to find out who has trucks and who has removed stuff and small guy enforcement. I was in a way told by the shop that did my emissions that they are taking pictures of the hardware and documenting it which is why they have a closed off area that isn't visible to the customers to do the testing now so you can't see what they are doing. I bet they are encrypting the ECM etc so it makes it so you can't change stuff blah blah blah I currently have software and a laptop that will show me what the config is but if the memory or storage is encrypted I can't see it without a key to unlock it. I hope its just the EPA being stupid but I can't not wonder about the longterm desire to get rid of ICE engines etc

 

[The Rock Man]

wonder what they would do if I encrypted my ECM then took it to them for the flash hum DUH they can't change it.

 

[mesha]

what happened with the flash I have some partial findings ill share in a bit

When I went to pick it up last night it was not finished. I should be able to pick it up today. More than an entire day for a flash

 

[The Rock Man]

When I went to pick it up last night it was not finished. I should be able to pick it up today. More than an entire day for a flash

keep me posted

 

[mesha]

Picked it up and it drives way better. I think it probably has to do with the software update more than the recall, but it is significantly better. My truck is a 2017 3500 dually. As far as all the def stuff goes I can’t tell yet.

They also managed to find 8800 dollars of work they wanted me to have them do…..I won’t be doing that but they always find something. They even offered to replace my batteries for only 958 dollars. 👍😂

 

[N-Smooth]

I guess I have until the end of April to research this as that's when I need to renew it. Thanks for the updates, guys.

 

[The Rock Man]

I guess I have until the end of April to research this as that's when I need to renew it. Thanks for the updates, guys.

I will be posting other findings as I get them from the folks I talk to waiting on what the TFL guys say as well as the folks at Banks engineering

 

[1969honda]

This whole EPA money grab makes me glad I bought a pre-EGR/DEF '07 5.9L. With the new 6.7L going in, I get the best of both worlds, without the BS.

 

[The Rock Man]

This whole EPA money grab makes me glad I bought a pre-EGR/DEF '07 5.9L. With the new 6.7L going in, I get the best of both worlds, without the BS.

I bet they will eventually make you put a DPF filter in it. it is just a matter of time before we are mandated. Unless we .........

 

[1969honda]

It didn't come from the factory with one so how can they make me add one? It's going to take a very smart inspector to figure out it is 6.7L. The truck VIN and ECM both say it is a 5.9CR. In reality when it's all done and back together, it will be a 6.7L, running 03-04 injectors, with all '07 electronics. So the VIN check and any scan equipment will think it is a 5.9 CR.

 

[The Rock Man]

It didn't come from the factory with one so how can they make me add one? It's going to take a very smart inspector to figure out it is 6.7L. The truck VIN and ECM both say it is a 5.9CR. In reality when it's all done and back together, it will be a 6.7L, running 03-04 injectors, with all '07 electronics. So the VIN check and any scan equipment will think it is a 5.9 CR.

hope your right but I have a couple of friends that use to drive there older semi's to California and now they don't because they didn't or wouldn't upgrade them with dpf 's and src's "def" because they started checking at every weigh station. so now that go to texas and New Mexico and AZ but that won't last forever