Death Wobble Ram 2500

[Houndoc]

We had several episodes of "death wobble" in our 2005, Ram 2500 Quad Cab. It is totally stock, about 90k miles.

Dealer dealt with the issue via a major overhaul of the front end.

Now we are fighting with Chrysler to get re-embursed for the cost of repairs. Searches have shown this to be a significant issue with these model trucks (some efforts are going on to get a recall forced.)

I would like to know if anyone else here has had this problem in similar ages of Rams. May help in my dealings with the company.

 

[BCGPER]

Three guys here at work have had the same issue. Two were repaired for free, under warranty. The third guy, just yesterday, shelled out $800 for the repairs at 36,400 miles. I told him about the TSB on it, and he's trying to get his money back now. I wished him luck, dealing with LHM.

 

[Gravy]

Please don't take this the wrong way, because you're a really good friend of mine.. but I did tell you how to fix it before you had the dealer fix it. And what needed to be fixed. You can't expect to pay first and try to get your money back. It isn't the way to go...

At 90k miles you should expect to be replacing things like tie rod ends on steering, trackbar bushings, ball joints and unit bearings anyways. Especially on a vehicle that spends most of its time towing. What exaggerates the problem is that when you tow and the rear end squats it changes the caster even more.


I imagine this is what they put on (swap from "Y" style to "T" style steering)
Steering Kit (PN # 2122362AB) and Steering Stabilizer (PN # 52122370AA).

Parts Required:
52106909AE--Damper, Steering
05086146AC--End Package, Tie Rod Outer
05086144AC--End Package, Tie Rod and Link Outer
06505623AA--Nut and Washer, Tie Rod

52122362AB--Steering Kit, $187
52122370AA--Steering Stabilizer, $138
6505623AA--Nuts (3), to attach new linkage
6502835--Nuts (2), to attach steering damper
6502473--Bolt (1), to attach steering damper

The linkage parts # has been superceded again from 52122362AB to AE,[E for more Expensive]? $222.00 [was $138.00]

It's easy to swap to the new style steering yourself and go and get an alignment, and have them set the caster closer to 5* instead of the factory 7-8*

Sure the dealer is more expensive that a normal repair shop, did Dodge do something wrong?
In my opinion: No.
Every straight axle Dodge/ Chrysler/ Jeep came with "Y" style steering from 1985 onto '00 (in WJ's) and '05 in the Ram.
I've even seen death wobble in IFS Silverado's and loads of straight axle rigs including new Fords with "T" style steering with worn out components.

Dodge just designed a better steering setup in later model Dodges and started to retrofit older vehicles with newer steering.

The good news is that you don't have death wobble anymore! right?

 

[ricsrx]

I just did my ball joints and alignment but it still pulls to the right and the caster is off, its a little squirrely, and slight steering wheel shake.

I may need more steering parts....

 

[Bob B]

when does it death wobble?
high speed, low speed, when you hit a bump, whats the condition of your front tires. as you know a ton of things can cause this, could you please give us some more info as to when it does it and how severe. Can you accelerate out of it, can you swerve out of it or do you have to slam on your brakes?

 

[bryson]

Common problem on many rigs... Solid axle dodges and Jeeps seem to be most susceptible to it, but I've seen it in IFS chevs, many solid axle fords, and even in an Eagle Talon. Pretty much anything with worn or misaligned suspension components invites the problem.

I certainly don't think it is anything you're gonna get Chrysler to pay for, nor do I think they should. As long as you keep up on maintenance on your steering components, and regularly check your bearings and bushings, and keep the truck aligned with decent tires, this won't be a problem you'll have again.

As far as the TSB goes, I think those are just for information purposes only - That doesnt mean it's a warranty or recall issue. The dealer won't pay for TSB work.

 

[Corban_White]

As far as the TSB goes, I think those are just for information purposes only - That doesnt mean it's a warranty or recall issue. The dealer won't pay for TSB work.

If you are still under warranty all TSBs are covered. Out of warranty, out of luck.

 

[Houndoc]

The real issue is that the parts where not worn. Had that confirmed by both independant mechanic and at the dealer. I would not have been surprised had they been, considering the miles and frequent (1-2x week) towing.

Bryson, not a maintaince or wear issue. Alignment, tires etc were fine. Turns out it has been an issue with these rigs, many with far fewer miles than ours.

Had it been from worn parts, I would have no complaint and certainly would not be seeking money back from Dodge.

The death wobble had been happening most always at freeway speeds, as often or even more so when not towing then when trailering. Triggered usually by irregular road surfaces (had it once at only about 35 after crossing cattle gaurd.)

Had to slow dramitically, several times to full stop, always under 40mph to stop episode.

Stratton, you did indeed. However, at least now my wife is mad at Dodge, not at me as she would have been had our (your) ideas not solved the problem. That is certainly worth some $$.

We are still working with Dodge over the issue, as it is a problem National Highway Transportation Safety Board has received numerous complaints over (our included.)

 

[mbryson]

Which tires are you running? Does anything change if you swap tires front/rear?

 

[Nate R]

I have an '03, that has only 63k, that I really feel time is near to have to front end gone through.

My truck has a level kit and 33" tires (bought that way from the Dodge dealer) Although it doesn't have the death wobble, it seams like the truck wonders more and more going down the road.

So if Dodge did a mass safety recall right now that would really ease the pain on my pocket book!

Really though, my work has a fleet of 10 Dodge 2500/3500's that range in years 2004 to current and they all have had major front end work. There is no doubt a problem that needs to get figured out.

-Nate

 

[Shawn]

I have an 2005 3500 dually,,, is this problem common with this truck also? 40K miles and 80% of that is towing miles. I can haul at any speed with my pinky on the wheel.

 

[planman]

It is kind of after the fact, but here is a write-up I did for jeep owners about DW on a 5 link (4 control arms and a trackbar) front end:

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f96/diagnosing-death-wobble-fixing-non-dw-shimmies-wobbles-1052221/

 

[Bob B]

I would have the tires rebalanced. It's a cheap way to rule out that, which is very often time the problem.

You said high speed.....high speed is almost always tire balance.

Look at how you tires are balanced, are the weights spread around, on the inside and outside of the rim?

take the truck to a tire place and have them balance them using a static balance. What I mean by static is using stick on weights, in one spot, on the inside of the rim closest to centerline. Problem is most tire places will fight you on a static balance. They will throw around things like roadmaster blah blah blah. Just stick to it and have them balance the tires this way.

we had a customer that had a dodge truck, he came to the shop and was telling us about it. The dealership basically replaced the front end twice. SO we told him to have them balance the tires this way.. They fought him on it and wouldn't do it. He brought it to our shop and we balance d them this way.......poof.... cured!

Now that being said, I am not guarenteeing (SP) this is the end all for your problem, but its cheap and it rules out one more thing if it still happens

This is just my .02, but I deal with death wobble ALOT.. Usually an average of 3-4 cases a week. i have a stock 03 3500 dually dodge with 137,000 miles and I have had no problems with death wobble.

Hope this helps.

 

[mbryson]

I would have the tires rebalanced. It's a cheap way to rule out that, which is very often time the problem.

You said high speed.....high speed is almost always tire balance.

Look at how you tires are balanced, are the weights spread around, on the inside and outside of the rim?

take the truck to a tire place and have them balance them using a static balance. What I mean by static is using stick on weights, in one spot, on the inside of the rim closest to centerline. Problem is most tire places will fight you on a static balance. They will throw around things like roadmaster blah blah blah. Just stick to it and have them balance the tires this way.

we had a customer that had a dodge truck, he came to the shop and was telling us about it. The dealership basically replaced the front end twice. SO we told him to have them balance the tires this way.. They fought him on it and wouldn't do it. He brought it to our shop and we balance d them this way.......poof.... cured!

Now that being said, I am not guarenteeing (SP) this is the end all for your problem, but its cheap and it rules out one more thing if it still happens

This is just my .02, but I deal with death wobble ALOT.. Usually an average of 3-4 cases a week. i have a stock 03 3500 dually dodge with 137,000 miles and I have had no problems with death wobble.

Hope this helps.

I was thinking more along the lines of cord separation or similar. If he just swaps tires front/rear and the symptoms change he could look to the tires. I'd do the balance first like you mention.

 

[jackjoh]

Help me here, I always thought that dynamic balance was the way to go because weights would be on the inside and outside of rim and they were balanced at various speeds.

 

[toyota rockhead]

my dad had a 03 with the same problem and they couldn't figure out what the problem was. they tried putting a dual stabilizer and a few different things. he ended up taking the stock wheels off and putting on a set of aftermarket wheels and it fixed the problem. the stock wheels that he had would keep dirt between the two parts of the wheel and cause them to not be balanced. i would check into trying a different set of wheels a lot of people were having these problems when the new body style came out.

 

[Bob B]

yes a dynamic balance does exactly that, put weights around the rim in different locations. Which might be ok at first, but as the tire gets worn some and then gets up to higher speeds than what it was balanced at, the weights can work against each other. If you hit a bump it will send a ripple though the tire, that ripple can unbalance the tire for a split second. if the weights are spread all around, then it works as a chain reaction and theres your wobble... Where as a static balance using stick on weights in the center of the rim won't have the weights working together to keep the tire wobbling..Hope that makes sense.

Im not saying a dynamic balance isn't good, but I have found that high speed wobble is usually cured with a static balance..
Just my experience.

 

[jackjoh]

Thanks, good info.

 

[Houndoc]

Really though, my work has a fleet of 10 Dodge 2500/3500's that range in years 2004 to current and they all have had major front end work. There is no doubt a problem that needs to get figured out.

-Nate

Exactly.

And to clarify to those with comments made with completely good intentions, this is certainly not a tire balance issue. I am familiar with poorly balanced tires and there is a huge difference than that and the death wobble we were having.

Too soon to say for sure, but things seem to be solved mechanically speaking.

 

[Gravy]

I believe what they are refering to is the fact that death wobble can also be cause by tires out of balance rotationally and side to side.