Doubler Dilema

[mswasey]

I have 74 Bronco with a 5.0, C-4, D20, Dana 60's and 42's with the wheelbase stretched to 105". I need some lower gears in a bad way. A 4 speed Atlas is out of the question because of $.
Option 1: The ultimate in strength for a doubler in my rig would be to change to a C-6, 203, 205 combination which would cause a bunch of extra work to move my links, cross members and exhaust. I would also have extra expense in going through the new transmission and transfer case.
Option 2: That being said, my C-4 is in great shape as is my Dana 20 which also has the HD output shaft. If I retained these pieces and added a 203 doubler I would not need to do as much retrofit. I am not too concerned about the strength of the C-4 but the Dana 20 has me a little concerned if I put a 203 in front of it.
Opdion 3: Keep the C-4 add a 203 and use a 205 behind it instead of my Dana 20.
Thoughts????

 

[Kiel]

From the looks of it if your comfortable with the c4 holding up or are prepared to dump money into it if it doesn't the #3 option looks best

 

[Rot Box]

What gears are in you D20 now? A Klune-V underdrive (www.klunev.com) should be a cheaper/lighter alternative than option #1, and all the work involved in adapting that.
Just an idea.......

 

[mswasey]

Thanks for your thoughts, I really like the Klune idea with light weight and more gearing options but it's about $1,800 plus adapters which puts into the Atlas range. Gearing in the Dana 20 is 2.34.

 

[Milner]

Keep the C4. It will hold up fine and a C6 is huge and sucks power!!

I would say either the Klune or one of the DIY Klune clones that are on POR. And keep your 20. You have the HD rear output already, the only weak spot will be your front output. I did blow 2 of those, but at least one was due to binding. Make sure you bearings are good, and the front out put is shimmed pretty tight and it should hold up. Also your shortest option aside from Stack or Atlas.
(Have you checked Kades' price on the Atlas ) Also consider the 231/241 planetaries are 2.73:1, a little lower than the 203, and your stock 2.43 is a little lower than the 205....

A 205 is BIG to stuff between EB frame rails, and the 203/205 combo is heavy and long.

 

[Rot Box]

2.34's...... have you considered installing 4:1's in the D20 or even swaping in a 4:1 D300 as an upgrade? A gearset sould be decently priced, and well worth it. I don't know who has the best deals on them, but that's where the other Bronco and Jeep guy's come in. Good Luck.

 

[Kawi_babe]

you didn't mention what ratios you have in your axles... maybe going alittle deeper and adding a 4:1 in the D20 or like before me said going to a D300 this combo will lower your gears enough if done right...

 

[Milner]

Really no strength difference from 300 to 20 in stock config, and HD aftermarket stuff is about the same for both. c4 or c6 to 300 adapter gets $$ (but need for a 241/231/Klune). And the biggest issue with a 300 is that it is a pside drop and the EB is a dside dif....so to use a 300 you would need a flip kit....

 

[mswasey]

My diff's are at 5.38 now so I don't want to go any deeper to avoid losing much strength on the pinion.
I haven't given much thought to the 231/241, are you suggesting using that instead of the 203? Are adapters common from the C-4 and going to say the D-20 or 205?
There is a low gear set for the Dana 20 that's 4.86 but it's like $1600, still only one low gear option and the same strength.

 

[Rot Box]

Yeah you could do a LOT of better things for $1600 (I'm used to Toyota pricing on gear boxes :-\ ). Option 3 keeps looking better in my opinion.....keep us posted!

 

[radjeeper]

How about a low gear set? They are 3.15 to 1 and Wild Horses kit is about $850.00. Doublers are nice but by the time you add up the parts (doubler kit, shifter, diveshaft work, 203 box, crossmember, etc.) how much are you spending? Just the kit from Wild Horses is around $1200.

 

[mswasey]

I don't feel that the Tera gear set is low enough at 3.15. It would only put my final crawl ratio at 39.8, even when factoring in the slip in the automatic I don't think it's enough of a jump.
I think with junkyard parts and doing everything else myself, I could be into the doubler for about $1500.
C-4 to 203 adapter $549
203 $100
203 to 205 adapter $480
205 $100
fab my own shifters and cross members and a minimal amount of driveshaft work and hopefully be at around $1500 and have a final crawl ratio of 48.4 or even keep the Dana 20 and be at around 58 to 1.

 

[Milner]

I don't feel that the Tera gear set is low enough at 3.15. It would only put my final crawl ratio at 39.8, even when factoring in the slip in the automatic I don't think it's enough of a jump.
I think with junkyard parts and doing everything else myself, I could be into the doubler for about $1500.
C-4 to 203 adapter $549
203 $100
203 to 205 adapter $480
205 $100
fab my own shifters and cross members and a minimal amount of driveshaft work and hopefully be at around $1500 and have a final crawl ratio of 48.4 or even keep the Dana 20 and be at around 58 to 1.

What I was suggesting is the 231/241 planetary, not the whole case.
I think it is Mad Rooster that is working on the DIY range box using the planetary and a EB 20. You would need a c4 to 300/231/241 adapter (about the same $ as the 203 adapter) Used 231/241 are about the same $ as 203, Mad Rooster is about same $ as 203-205, and no need for the 205. 231 planetary is rate about 1000ft/lb and 241 is 1300ft/lbs along with a 7.73 reduction. This is basically what the 4 spd Atlas uses too.

I still say save $$ over the winter and just do a Stack or 4sd Atlas....You know you want too:greg:

 

[Milner]

And....
I had the Tera gears for a while, they were ok, but not much lower than stock
I was impressed that they held up to my abuse

 

[mswasey]

I still say save $$ over the winter and just do a Stack or 4sd Atlas....You know you want too:greg:

Oh yea.....I want to!!! Maybe the justification process (and the saving process is about to start.
The Atlas or Stack is the best option in every way, except price that is. Hmmmm..........

 

[timpanogos]

I've got a 205 available if you decide to go that way

 

[mswasey]

I still say save $$ over the winter and just do a Stack or 4sd Atlas....You know you want too:greg:

Oh yea, there is also the $500 adapter that I would need to run the 4 speed Atlas with my C-4!

 

[mbryson]

Oh yea, there is also the $500 adapter that I would need to run the 4 speed Atlas with my C-4!

That's NASTY.............


Just checked the Novak site and they don't have ANY F*rd trannies........ That sucks

 

[Milner]

Oh yea, there is also the $500 adapter that I would need to run the 4 speed Atlas with my C-4!

Yep, same as yo would with the planetary option....the 4 spd Atlas is more or less a 241 hooked to an Atlas....dana 300/231/241 to c4, but that adpt is around 2" shorter than the stock c4 to 20 adpt....4spd atlas with a stubby rear output is hardly any longer than you are now....

Just call me the devil on your shoulder:greg:
Tell your wife its my fault....I can take the heat

 

[Rot Box]

In my opinion there are only a couple rigs out there (besides buggies) that I would even dream of dumping that much money into......and an EB is definatly one of them.

I'd do the 4-speed if I was spending your money