drive train suggestions?

[DGM99TJ]

I have been thinking about some potential swaps to my drivetrain in my 99 2.5L TJ. Let me know what you think!!!

Engine: Hesco 4.7L motor
Trans: NV4500 (compound 1st gear)
T-case: dana 300 (w/flip kit of coarse)
Klune-V underdrive (creepy crawly)
Axles: Dana 44's or 60's
Lift: RE long arm kit

I love to wheel but the four banger could use some more power for the street and the rocks. I seem to always get in situations where a very low low crawl ratio would help (nv4500, klune-v). I know this would cost a pretty penny but you've got to start somewhere. Let me know if anyone has seen these swaps and how they all work together!!!!!!

 

[JeepTJ38]

Thats alot of money. I am doing this:
5.3 Vortec
4L60E tranny
NP231 (4.1)
D60 rear

Not to steal your thread but what is your goal ? With the 4.7 and Nv4550 and dana300 you should have a good crawl without the crawl box but it's your jeep. What size tire do you plan on running ? Also look at compatibility (shaft splines) and bolt patterns between your components as adapters are pretty expensive for a chunk of metal.

 

[Andy]

If your going that far, get a V8 (which ever suits your fancy) a 700r4, and an Atlas= happy Jeeper. As for axles, how much money do you want to spend? The only reason I say get an Atlas is that your most of the way there by the time you get the HD output and the flip kit.

 

[DGM99TJ]

thanks for the tips

my goal with this setup are all the different gearing options that the klune-v offers. like i said before, I have come into situations where a super low crawl ratio would help. maybe the klune-v with the compound 1st gear would be too low? is a compoud 1st and factory 4w-lo sufficient for most technical rockcrawling?

i've heard that just going with a 4:1 t-case basically makes 4w-lo only good for rockcrawling? I do more fourwheeling than just rockcrawling.

I want to run 35-37" tires eventually.

as for axles, I need to do more research on the cost and which ones would be best.

Basically I'm just trying to find some drive train solutions that will give me the most options for the best value.

 

[Greg]

If you're looking for versatility, minimal expense & the Klune (Sounds like you're dead set on owning one,) I'd suggest a Chevy 4.3, 4L60E Auto Tranny (Isn't that what 700R4's are called these days?) the Klune, then your stock 231 case.

Of course, upgrade the output on the T-Case.

You have the ease of operating a Auto, then 3 choices for gearing. You can use the stock T-Case by itself for easy stuff, the Klune for slightly more technical situations, then both together for the real nasty trails. That should be plenty of gearing, combined w/ 4.56's-4.88's in the diffs.

The downside may be driveshaft lenght in the rear.... Consider a High Pinion axle of your choice.

 

[DGM99TJ]

Of course, upgrade the output on the T-Case.


The downside may be driveshaft lenght in the rear.... Consider a High Pinion axle of your choice. [/B][/QUOTE]


because of driveshaft length i thought a dana 300 or atlas II would work better because they are so much shorter. adding a klune-v with everything elses starts to get a little long for a tj

would upgrading the output on the t-case make it strong enough or would the t-case need to be replaced eventually (chain driven)?

 

[JeepTJ38]

once you switch the output shaft it's pretty strong, but if your crazy they do make a wide chain kit ot beef it up even more. The auto should soak up alot of the drivetrain shock so you should be OK.

 

[Caleb]

unless you really scoot the motor up in the front I dont think you will have enough drive shaft...considering you will loose a lot with an auto and then even more with the klune...if you dont plan on doing a lot of crawling then you are just wasting money on the klune...the auto can fudge on your gearing when you need to crawl...like most have said before, if you are swapping the motor you amy as well make it worth your time and go with a V8...there is no more work to do to make a V8 fit then to make a 4.0 ft where a 2.5 used to be...you have to remove the motor mounts either way...

FWIW, the 4L60e is essentially the same thing as the 700R4 except the 4l60e is computer controlled where the 700 isn;t...

 

[JeepTJ38]

Not to take your thread but I just got my 5.3L Vortec settled in my bay and its pretty tight with the headers and factory exhaust but it works. i have seen dodge V10 slammd into TJ and YJ so dont worry about space just lenght. You could get realy nutty and extend your wheelbase

 

[DGM99TJ]

Originally posted by supergper
like most have said before, if you are swapping the motor you amy as well make it worth your time and go with a V8...there is no more work to do to make a V8 fit then to make a 4.0 ft where a 2.5 used to be...you have to remove the motor mounts either way...

If i swap in a V8 do i still need really low gears or does the horsepower make up the difference? and will i still have the slow crawl to give me better control on the tuff stuff and not be bouncing on the rocks?

 

[JeepTJ38]

Im still waiting to see how this works as well. i have been told that the tourqe converted gives you a pretty good gear reduction untill the stall sped hits but here is my gearing:
4l60e (Actually im not sure what first gear is)
NP231 4.1 low range
4.88's in the pumkins
The axle gears seem kinda low but the transmission has like and 80% overdrive so the freeway should still be nice while retaining a good low range for fast 4wheeling and even better in 4low.

 

[DGM99TJ]

Originally posted by JeepTJ38
i have been told that the tourqe converted gives you a pretty good gear reduction untill the stall sped hits

how does the torque converter work, and what is "stall speed"? I kind of have an idea but any help would be great

 

[JeepTJ38]

Im not an expert but the tourque converted uses two halves with ATF fluid between them when the engine spins it spins one side until enough fluid is sloshing against the other side witch is hooked to the rest of the tranny to transmit the force. The speed that this happens is the stall speed. So your engine will usually be doing 1000-1500 or so untill it starts to turn the tranny and that gives you a little better ump when you start moving the vehicle.
i wanted to run a NV4500 but went with the auto becasue it would help absorb the shock of the V8 from the rest of the driveline.

 

[Caleb]

basically with a torque converter you get about a 1.6-2.0 multiplication untill you hit the stall speed...but when you haven;t hit the stall speed you build a lot of heat and heat in autos is very bad (its the number one killer for autos)...yes you would be able to crawl without bouncing all around and such without the crawl box...you would do fine...I am building mine strictly for the rocks but I will be able to do sand mud or whatever because I have an auto, 4.10s in the diffs, and I have a doubler setup so I will have 1:1, 2:1, and 4:1...IMO I say drop the crawler and see how you like it...if you want it a little lower then get it in the diffs (thats cheaper than the klune anyways)...

 

[DGM99TJ]

i know this is a little off subject but a couple of you guys have mentioned putting autos instead of manuel tranny's in when you do swaps. why are you using autos instead of manuels? what are the pros and cons? I never really thought about an automatic transmission before.

also, what is a doubler? is it the same as a crawl box?

 

[RockMonkey]

Yep, an auto is the way to go. Think about why you need the super low gears. Is it so you can go super slow on the really tough sections without stalling the engine or riding the clutch? Well, with an auto you can go as slow as you want and the engine won't stall, and you don't have a clutch to burn out doing this. Take a look at any rock crawling competition. Prolly 90% of those guys are using an automatic transmission. You won't need that super low ($$$) gearing you were thinking about, so you can still use the rig for the other types of wheeling you want to do. Also, You are into quite a bit of money with a flipped 300, and a ton of money by the time you add a Klune, and then you have less room for a drive shaft. Just get an Atlas (for less than the 300 and Klune). There is no other transfer case that can compare to the Atlas, and it sounds liek you have the cash...

 

[DGM99TJ]

so what are some good engine transmission swaps for a TJ? which ones are more common, have good results, and are cost effective (i don't want to be the gineau pig trying to peice something together no one has done before, $$$$)?

...and no I don't have money... but I like to think ahead, it helps me save for things when I know what I want.

 

[RockMonkey]

Well, actually your best and most cost effective option may be to sell your TJ, and buy one that has a 4.0 and a factory automatic. Depending on the year, milage, and condition of the two vehicles you may be able to break even, or even make money on the deal. Then all you have to do is sell the stock t-case, and buy an Atlas and put it in. Then you can do whatever for suspension and axles. Another option would be a 4.3 (or 350) Chevy motor, and a th350, but then I think you need an adapter for the Atlas.

 

[Hickey]

easy to drive, easy to shift, less jarring force on the rest of the drive train. Plus, for HALF the price of a NV4500, you could have one hell of a nice auto built.

 

[Hickey]

Originally posted by RockMonkey
Well, actually your best and most cost effective option may be to sell your TJ, and buy one that has a 4.0 and a factory automatic.

This is what I would do. The 4.0 is a very good motor, and has a very good auto behind it.