Durgango steering box swap on TJ ?

[jeepinkeller]

Whats up everyone My steering on my TJ is about ready to die, it whines like a banshee when trying to turn my 33's on the trail, and I am about ready to swap it out. I've heard the j-20's and the waggy boxes work ok for an upgrade, and recently have heard about swapping a box from a 99 durango 4x4. I would think these would be easier to come by than the j-20's.
Has anyone here done this swap? Has it improved steering over the stock set up? How much was it? I basically just need more info so any information would help alot. Thanks

 

[Caleb]

Well, are you sure its your box whining? usually whining coming fromt eh steering system is from the pump not the box. Although I have never dealt with a bunk box. if its a sag box it should just bolt right in. Another option I would suggest s to take you box to Rocklogic and have them rebuild it and tap it for hydro-assist. You dont have to run the assist right now (you can just plug it) but it would be a HUGE improvement over stock.

Rocklogic 463-1220

 

[jeepinkeller]

thanks for the info, any idea on how much that would cost?

 

[Caleb]

I dont know for sure how much but I am sure you could give them a call and they could tell you real easily. They are way cool and easy to talk to up there.

 

[RockMonkey]

As Caleb said, you've got a bad pump. Replacing it will help, but ideally you should do the hydro assist thing.

 

[Cody]

I think one of the reasons people like the j20 boxes is because they use 4 bolts to mount instead of three. You'll need to drill a hole through your frame for the fourth bolt.

as was stated earlier, if you're looking for more turning power, hydro assist is the way to go.

Cody

 

[jeepinkeller]

Do you think hydro assist would be a little over kill for just 33's?

 

[RockMonkey]

Do you think hydro assist would be a little over kill for just 33's?

No, NEVER! Hydro assist rocks with any size tires!

 

[Spork]

Alright it's time for the stupid question...
Do you have any power steering fluid?

I would replace the pump first my steering got a lot easier with the pump replaced.

 

[jeepinkeller]

ya my power steering fluid is full

 

[EZRhino]

Anther thing that makes pumps whine is a loose or bad belt.

EZ

 

[jeepinkeller]

Anther thing that makes pumps whine is a loose or bad belt.

EZ

Well it doesnt just whine, it gets hard to steer and has little or no turning power when I get it tight situations when I need it the most.

 

[Caleb]

Well it doesnt just whine, it gets hard to steer and has little or no turning power when I get it tight situations when I need it the most.

Have you ensured your belt is tight? If the belt starts to slip (wether its loose or just worn) you will loose pressure which in turn will cause loss of turning power. So I would check that out and check you pump before condemning the the box

 

[jeepinkeller]

Good idea, ill check that out thanks

 

[jedijeeper]

On saginaw steering gears you can definitely get a whine when the assist valve begins to fail (ie, it can't decide whether to pass fluid through the system to help you or to work directly against the input you are giving). It is, however, a distinctly different whine than the power steering pump will have when it's veins are pulling air or are worn out.

Have a buddy run the steering (with the engine running ) while you listen either with your ears or, more preferrably, with a stethoscope to the steering gear and the pump. If the gear is actually whining it will obviously be much louder from the gear itself. (BTW...don't get the stethoscope caught in the fan or belts or you're gonna have some fun ) If the gear is failing you will get a much higher pitched, almost squeal, rather than whiny noise a failing pump will have (sorry, best I can do without a tape recorder!).

Your steering gear can be replaced or rebuilt, that's up to you and the cash you have available... don't do it though if this is just a pump problem. The Durango gear works fine as does the Wagoneer/Cherokee/J10-20 box. None of them is tougher than the other and all should have the same ratio, although I am not totally sure on the Durango version's ratio on this (easy way to tell is to count the turns on the input side from wheel lock to wheel lock).

If you replace or rebuild the gear, definitely tap for the assist ram if possible, even if you are not going to buy one just yet. There is a great write up in this months JP mag about using the one from West Texas Off Road if you want to see how it's done. And 33's are plenty big to be helped by an assist ram (I don't say hydro-assist because to me it's redundant.. isn't that what your original power steering gear is ?)

Junk yards are loaded with Saginaw steering boxes if you go that route. There are even many passenger car versions that will work as well. Just stay away from the sports car versions (ie Trans-AM, Z28, etc.) as a lot of those had a tighter ratio for quicker steering and will just exasperate your steering difficulties.

Good luck!

-JJ

 

[jeepinkeller]

On saginaw steering gears you can definitely get a whine when the assist valve begins to fail (ie, it can't decide whether to pass fluid through the system to help you or to work directly against the input you are giving). It is, however, a distinctly different whine than the power steering pump will have when it's veins are pulling air or are worn out.

Have a buddy run the steering (with the engine running ) while you listen either with your ears or, more preferrably, with a stethoscope to the steering gear and the pump. If the gear is actually whining it will obviously be much louder from the gear itself. (BTW...don't get the stethoscope caught in the fan or belts or you're gonna have some fun ) If the gear is failing you will get a much higher pitched, almost squeal, rather than whiny noise a failing pump will have (sorry, best I can do without a tape recorder!).

Your steering gear can be replaced or rebuilt, that's up to you and the cash you have available... don't do it though if this is just a pump problem. The Durango gear works fine as does the Wagoneer/Cherokee/J10-20 box. None of them is tougher than the other and all should have the same ratio, although I am not totally sure on the Durango version's ratio on this (easy way to tell is to count the turns on the input side from wheel lock to wheel lock).

If you replace or rebuild the gear, definitely tap for the assist ram if possible, even if you are not going to buy one just yet. There is a great write up in this months JP mag about using the one from West Texas Off Road if you want to see how it's done. And 33's are plenty big to be helped by an assist ram (I don't say hydro-assist because to me it's redundant.. isn't that what your original power steering gear is ?)

Junk yards are loaded with Saginaw steering boxes if you go that route. There are even many passenger car versions that will work as well. Just stay away from the sports car versions (ie Trans-AM, Z28, etc.) as a lot of those had a tighter ratio for quicker steering and will just exasperate your steering difficulties.

Good luck!

-JJ

Wow thanks for all the good info man!