Expedition vehicle

[Cascadia]

Wow Steve. You said a lot, and it wasn't annoying or painful to read. Thank you for taking the time writing everything you did. I know you have been where I am and have a lot of great insight because of it. I have a lot of questions to answer to myself. I feel like most everything you said applies not only to vehicles but also to life in general. I need to read over those a few more times and answer them to myself for all aspects of my life. I'm sure I will find a lot of things I'm doing wrong and "not for me". I wish I could have a longer response for you to make it worth your while. Just know that I'm pondering and you've got some great questions for me, or anyone to answer.

 

[frieed]

Yes you will..... It's called a Samurai!!!!

I'd like to see you sleep in it ....

 

[sixstringsteve]

Glad to help tyson. The root of my problem wasn't really vehicle-related, it was a deeper, more internal struggle I was having. I hope you can find the ways to reach your goals and desires. for selfish reasons, I hope you end up with something that allows you to tag along on our trips, i enjoy.wheeling.with you.

 

[mesha]

The only way to know what you need for your style of expedition, is to go on some. You will find that whatever rig you have will fit because you will go on expeditions that work for your setup. 2 days can be an expedition for some, while others will need to spend a few months trekking across the globe to go on an expedition. Getting out and camping with your wife and 8 month old is more of a challenge than some people recognize. To me driving across the wilderness away from anyone for a week unsupported would be an expedition, in australia that is called the commute to work

This year we did trips in all of our vehicles. We went in the 97 chevy 2500 long bed that is stock. We did trips in the toyota corolla, we went out in the 4 door rubicon, and they were all enjoyable. Whatever you take out, you will make memories. Find joy in the journey not the mode of transportation.

I like certain things for my type of trip. I like big tires like 33"-37" not because I need them to go where I want but because they make trail a more enjoyable ride. those little rocks that are annoying get less annoying the bigger the tire gets. Not a requirement by any means, but it is what I like on my vehicles that spend time in the dirt. I really like 4 doors, but it isn't a necessity for me. The truck has 2 door and an extended cab. It works great for its purpose. The ability to store gear is important for me. any car, truck, van, etc will fit those needs. If the car is smaller I will take less gear. We did a sweet trip in the metro and had a blast. Reliability is also important, but it is prorated in my opinion. My sisters camping revolves around driving up in the mountains behind her house and sleeping in the back of her s10 blazer. It takes her 5-10 minutes to get to camp. Reliability is not as important to her. If her car brakes down 3 miles from her house it isn't a big deal. If you realistically camp in places close to home, or don't camp at all, then reliability is less important. I will probably get flamed for that statement, but it is what it is. Just because you don't have a car that is rated as the most reliable vehicle of all time doesn't mean you can't go camping.

I completely understand the fact that you don't want to unpack your tools from your truck every time you go out. That is a huge pain in the butt. As a contractor, you have a lot more heavy stuff in there than people realize. It isn't like you have 1 bag of tools in the back, you have 1-2 hours worth of unpacking just to start packing. I get that, I really do. It shouldn't stop you, but I understand. On tuesday this week, my wife told me at we were going to look for pine nuts after work. I had the jeep with me so we couldn't pack until I got home from work. I got home at 330 we were on the road by 4. That couldn't have happened in you truck. It would have been dark by the time you got into the hills to get the nuts. You could have packed in advance, but spur of the moment trips are fun in there own right.

I agree with most on here. Put some gas in whatever vehicle you have and go for it. You will quickly remember what suits you and that will help you narrow down what you need. If you don't get out before you have your "perfect rig" you wont get out when you do have it.

Your son won't remember whether you were in a tundra, a jeep, a civic, or a minivan. He will remember that dad made time for him. He will remember you teaching him to build a fire or pee in the woods. You won't remember how big your tires were or how awesome your lockers were. You will remember the first time your son did a sand angel, or came to you with a lizard in his hand. Your wife will remember the self reliance you instilled in your family. She will remember you spent time with them. I know that all sounds kind of cheesy, but it is how I feel.

let's go camping.

 

[Kevin B.]

It sounds like the Tundra fits all your needs except for the packing/unpacking thing. What about a set of bedside toolboxes on stands, like a camper? Jack them up and drive out from under your office. That'd be cheaper than another vehicle, right?

I'll second what Steve and Davy said, too - get outa town. Just go. Don't wait until your rig is perfect, because it won't ever be. And your kids aren't getting any younger.

 

[Cascadia]

There's so much info in the last few posts that I don't think I can respond to all of it. Davy, I like the idea of bigger tires for the same reasons. I have noticed a smoother ride when my tires are bigger compared to a stock sized tire. A smoother ride would help out with being able to go explore more. Especially if I need my boy to sleep part of the time. Unpacking my truck is always a pain. It's not the getting everything out of the truck that bothers me. It's putting it in the garage in its place and being organized so that I can still park in the garage after I am done with it. I don't like piles in my garage and I like the garage organized for the most part. It's my one area that I call mine. That is the reason mainly that I would want a third vehicle. The other reason is although my Tundra isn't a "full size" it is still big and I don't like driving big things around. I don't like parking, I don't like turning around, I don't like the long wheelbase of a truck, but in the end, a truck is what I need for work. As many of you know I have tried just about everything and I have come to the conclusion that I do need 3 vehicles in my family. I'm leaning towards a 4 runner of some sort but I don't want to break the bank and I want to have some extra money to do some basic mods to it. Maybe a 90-95 4 runner with a 22re or 3.4 swap would be nice.

 

[sixstringsteve]

Maybe a 90-95 4 runner with a 22re or 3.4 swap would be nice.

I agree, that'd be nice. It's gotten to the point where the old 22re runners cost as much or more than the '96-02 runners. The 22re runners are getting next to impossible to find, and the prices indicate just how in demand they are. Bring your Tundra on our trip on the 17th, you'll learn what you like and what you don't like about it. I think it'll be pretty eye-opening to actually go on an expedition style trip. It's probably nothing like you imagine.

 

[Kevin B.]

I'm leaning towards a 4 runner of some sort but I don't want to break the bank and I want to have some extra money to do some basic mods to it. Maybe a 90-95 4 runner with a 22re or 3.4 swap would be nice.

Good luck finding a second gen with a 22re. They're out there, but they aren't common. There's a 93 with a 3.0 for sale in the Classifieds section for not very much, that'd make a great "get out and about" rig if it was in decent shape.

 

[Cascadia]

I know it'll be hard to find. I've seen a few lately but wasn't sure what I wanted yet. I also think it'd be sweet to find a blown 3.0 and swap in a 3.4 or find one that's already swapped. I'll try and come out on your next trip, at least for part of it.

 

[Maverick]

Love the discussion here, I think we can probably all relate to one part of it or another.

Your question was about the best expedition rig, but it's a pretty short step from that to "best 4x4", and based on your definition of 2 days, 35" tires, etc, more like "backcountry 4x4 camping rig".

I know that I love bench racing (and building) as much as anyone else, but I have to continually remind myself to just GO. I have been jonesin' for a 4-door wrangler since they came out and I rented one in '07 and spent 3 days on the White Rim Trail and LOVED it (the jeep and the trail). And that was a rental with just 33x10.50 AT's. I vowed to buy one when my eXcursion was paid off.

However, by the time that happened last year, I had a realization that while a JK would be a great all purpose vehicle for me, I already had two really good, capable backcountry vehicles and I should just use them. I also realized that for all the backcountry expeditioning that I thought I'd do in my '99 burb (one of the main reasons I bought it), I never really did, cuz, well, I just didn't. I did other stuff.

We went rock-hounding in the burb a couple times, and to 5 mile pass once, but never multi-day "expeditioning". However, we did go on lots of Boy Scout campouts, and many trips to our mountain lot and lots of tow-the-jeep-somewhere events. My eXcursion took over burb duties in '05, helped build the cabin, and continued to be the vehicle of choice for many Scout and High Adventure outings, family trips, camping trips, rock-hounding trips, jeeping trips, etc. In '08 the rebuilt scrambler not only became better offroad, but onroad too and became a daily driver much of the year.

I don't have a vehicle that is as all-purpose as a JK, "Abner" or many of the other rigs mentioned here and owned by RME members, but I have two vehicles that are more specialized and work great for me. Hmmm, actually, technically, four (five?) vehicles, each with a specialized purpose (more or less). Are any of them expedition rigs (as defined above)? To me they are. And there's not a single RTT. Lots of D-ring shackles though, and 6 pair of tire chains. Here's the list:

F150 Supercrew work truck (not mine, but driven daily, trips to surrounding states, hundreds of dirt miles)
eXcursion: diesel, 8-pass, 35's. It's probably seen more miles of dirt and snow than my jeep has, and way more camping nights.
Scrambler: trail rig, rock crawler and daily driver, when it's not wounded.
Blazer: carries a 7' snowblower in the winter and is a fun rig for a 16yo in the summer.
old F150: RainbowRelicRig for multiday campouts in the 70's.

Is there a single rig that can do all that? Maybe a Raptor...

The ONLY thing I don't do now as much as I did when I drove my sammy and my cherokee is randomly explore roads when I'm on a trip somewhere. I have a few times in the eX, but it's not quite the same. Mainly cuz it's huge.

Last ramble: seems like a third vehicle is an easy solution, is there a reason you haven't done this already? Having a wheeler that you don't have to drive to work on Monday is a HUGE stress reliever. It made me crazy when I was wheelin' my cherokee, which was my only vehicle (besides my wife's car). I remember making the decision to go with a less "all purpose" vehicle and commit to more of a trailer queen (any jeep with 38's isn't gonna spend much time on the freeway). Even if I never trailered it, I'd probably still have a dedicated backcountry rig. It'd just have 35's instead of 39's.

YMMV

 

[sixstringsteve]

I know it'll be hard to find. I've seen a few lately but wasn't sure what I wanted yet. I also think it'd be sweet to find a blown 3.0 and swap in a 3.4 or find one that's already swapped.

That would be very sweet. Not necessary, but sweet.

I'll try and come out on your next trip, at least for part of it.

No. Try not. Do...or do not. There is no try.

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The last thing you want is to get squished like a grape.

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[Rot Box]

I'm leaning towards a 4 runner of some sort but I don't want to break the bank and I want to have some extra money to do some basic mods to it. Maybe a 90-95 4 runner with a 22re or 3.4 swap would be nice.

This might open a can of worms but why not a 3rd gen 4runner? The rack and pinion/coil strut front suspension components are far superior to the idler/pitman/torsion bar front ends and they already come with the engine(s) you want along with being in a similar price range. I've driven a 22RE 2nd gen and the only thing slower is a 22RE Dolphin/Chinook The nickels and dimes involved in an engine swap alone is going to cost more than just buying a 3rd gen in the first place.

 

[sixstringsteve]

This might open a can of worms but why not a 3rd gen 4runner? The rack and pinion/coil strut front suspension components are far superior to the idler/pitman/torsion bar front ends and they already come with the engine(s) you want along with being in a similar price range. I've driven a 22RE 2nd gen and the only thing slower is a 22RE Dolphin/Chinook The nickels and dimes involved in an engine swap alone is going to cost more than just buying a 3rd gen in the first place.

x2

 

[Cascadia]

This might open a can of worms but why not a 3rd gen 4runner? The rack and pinion/coil strut front suspension components are far superior to the idler/pitman/torsion bar front ends and they already come with the engine(s) you want along with being in a similar price range. I've driven a 22RE 2nd gen and the only thing slower is a 22RE Dolphin/Chinook The nickels and dimes involved in an engine swap alone is going to cost more than just buying a 3rd gen in the first place.

Unless I find a second gen already swapped. I'm not against a 3rd gen at all. I love them. I'm looking at them and considering them also. I can't believe how high the miles are on all 4runners.

 

[Rot Box]

I can't believe how high the miles are on all 4runners.

Agreed but not nearly as high as used Landcruisers lol

 

[sixstringsteve]

I think a honda CRV could be a sweet little exploring vehicle. OME even makes a lift for them. They get killer MPG, they're super reliable, and they're actually quite capable.



I'm not sure if they make snorkels for them, so they may not be "expo" enough.

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[sixstringsteve]

or you could just get one of these, I'm sure it'd meet all your needs.

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[Rot Box]

I think a honda CRV could be a sweet little exploring vehicle.

I approve this message.

With a light foot I finally pushed mine over 32miles per gallon this summer (typically hangs around 30-31) which translates into about 400 miles per tank. One thing that blows me away is the interior space as every nook and cranny has a shelf or cubby for storage. It even comes factory equipped foldout camp table (EXPO approved) that would make the dudes at Snow Peak blush :greg:

 

[4biker]

I'll chime in since my base rig would probably start out at about $5000. I personally love the idea of a CRV or big Tracker. They're small with small engines, so you get better mileage, and they're probably pretty dang comfortable on dirt roads with 4-wheel independent suspension. My 4Runner has been absolutely stellar for all of my needs. I just hit 191,000 miles on the odo, and I'm pulling a trailer up to the Uintas for the elk hunt this weekend. I'm more worried about the trailer than the 4Runner on trips like this. I love the reliability of it, not to mention it can actually tow my tent trailer. I also like to sleep in it, since I sleep like crap on the ground, and I can't always take the trailer. A stock 3rd Gen 4Runner will get you 99% of the places my built one will get you, and my IFS 4Runner will get me 99% of the places a more built rig will get. Like Steve said, it's all about wants/needs. I don't need a snorkel, but I've come pretty close to drowning myself before, so I got one. I don't need an ARB bumper, but I drive in the Uintas a couple times per year, and there are lots of radiator-busting deer to smash up there. Same with a winch. I'll probably never use it for recovery, but it's there if I need to pull a tree out of the road. I bought a rig that would work well for my family, and I've been lucky enough to be able to build it how I've always wanted one. That's taken me from what my needs are to what my wants are, and that's okay since I can finally get some wants after all these years. There will always be more I will want for it, but I did most of Hole in the rock on 32's last year with just sliders for armor. The only real reason I'd want to swap rigs is my auto ADD like everyone else has.

Honestly, I'd see how the Tundra does like has already been mentioned. If it were me, I'd build a cool offroad rack for the bed that a RTT would fit on, with an axe, shovel, fishing pole case, etc. bolted on the side. Have a second set of wheels/tires that you swap on for the weekend warrior-ing that will actually last more than 2 years. You be able to clear 255/85/16's without lift, which would look awesome. That way it turns into your expedition rig when you're out of "work" mode. and everything comes off and it turns back into a street truck that's perfect for work on Monday. You can do all that for pennies compared to buying and building a separate expedition rig that will be smaller and less powerful and less comfortable. Hmmm - maybe I'll do that. You want to trade?

*edit* I just re-read your post on the second page about the compelling reason to buy a third vehicle. My above statement was intended just as a suggestion, not knowing what the tool setup in your current truck is. I will submit that having a third vehicle wouldn't compel you to go camping more, but if you're going to go camping (or get out more), it could be worth it to you. A third vehicle means more registration fees, more oil changes, more maintenance, more alignments, etc. It's a great problem to have, especially if you have the means to run three vehicles. Just a thought.

 

[sixstringsteve]

fwiw, trackers have a solid rear axle. CR-Vs and Rav4s have independent front and rear suspension. I'd expect the 4-wheel independent suspension would tackle bumps better than 33-35" tires, but who knows. I think it'd be awesome to see a fleet of CRVs or ravs running around the backroads of utah.