FF D60 rear - 35 or 40 splines?

[Caleb]

The problem with the big companies, is none of them make a FF D60 and to my knowledge, the largest bolt pattern they work with is 6 lug.

I can build my own Rockcrusher high clearance HP axle for about $900 that would have 3"x.50" 4130 or 1026 tubes. But then you have to add in all of the locker, gears, etc. and all of that stuff that will nickle you to death - brakes... I think even if I took this D60 that I have, and put a 35 spline ARB, axles and 5.13's in it, I would still be under $2k and I'd still have a FFD60.

sorry but that doesn;t make much sense. You paid $950 for an axle housing you're thinking you'll only use the housing and brakes because to go to 35 spline shafts you'll need a new locker, new shafts, and machine work on the spindles. Then go to 5.13 gears and you'll need a new gear set and install kit.


OR, you could build a brand new Rockcrusher FF 60 for $900, then add those same gears, lockers, and shafts but have no machine work on the spindles. Brakes cost <$100 EASY for disc brakes which is probably what you'll be into at least the machine work for the other spindles.

So if my math is correct you've spent $50 more and have a used housing. sure you can recoup a little bit of your cost but most people aren;t going to be willing to spend much for a 30 spline detroit because most people are wanting to upgrade to 35 spline shafts as well. Used gears, well...are used gears.

I would have personally gone the Rockcrusher route for sure

 

[Shawn]

I assume they sell some good grass out there where you are now.......... eh?

 

[waynehartwig]

Very good drugs up here!

I would have to buy the center section seperate and have the tubes pushed in, which I'm not setup to do - that $900 is just for the center and tubes. Then I'd have to figure out a way to put spindles on it. The brakes are easy, like you say. As for paying someone to turn the spindles, I can do that myself - I do have the technology! ...I already have to turn the front spindles to run the 35 spline outers there...

It just seems to me that going that route would be more involved than going the other way.

 

[Kiel]

If you want to waste some money on axles you can only use parts from and pay a lot, I can point you to some other axles. I would just build the axle you want from scratch or get just a core and you'll save money and the headaches of selling something. Just seems like a lot of work and money just to get a 60 housing and brakes. Or you could just get a 70 like me, or a 14 bolt

 

[420willys]

so you have a 30 spline 60 now with 4.88's, disc brakes, your link or anti wrap bars welded on and a locker???? if you do then yes just upgrade to 35 spline buy boaring out the spindles and upgrade the locker. i still dont see the need for 40 spline for you. if you have no axle yet skip the 60 and go for a 70 or a 14 bolt, why go thru the hassle when theres a stock set up.

DEAD set on 60, find one from a mid 90's E-250 E-350 van, they have the big boar spindles and 32 spline shafts. my friend just put one in his rubi buggy and it was very easy to go 35 spline buy swapping to a full spool and the 35 spline blanks, the ones with 5 or 6'' of spline and you cut them in the chop saw to your spec.

dont over think this, the 14 bolt i have i beet it like it owes me money and never it has let me down. i have a 4.0, 700r, 231 HD and a very chooped up YJ, yes i lack the HP you have but i make it with the fact that i dont let off the skinney peddle. i even still run the stock 30 spline stubs in the front, i am on borrowed time with those i know this but i never think about the rear. do i have spares in the truck you bet, but the local junkyard near paragon ( also like every junkyard in the free world ) has spare 14 bolts. agin dont over think it just build it and have fun, jason.

 

[waynehartwig]

The 60 I have now is built and ready for me (if I stay with 4.88's, but if I'm going 35 spline, then I'm going 5.13's - I will be running 38.5" tires either way), other than the link tabs - it's setup for leaf right now.

I agree, 40 spline is more than I will need, but like I said before, I just figured since I'm going to be replacing everything to go 35, would it be advisable to just go 40. I've learned no, so I won't. I'm not even 100% sure I need 35 spline axles... I bet these 30's will be fine for me... I ran OEM 30 spline D44 shafts with 35" tires for a long time and only broke one when I went to 37" tires. At taht time I went to 4340 shafts and haven't broke one since...Even with 4.88's compared to the 4.10's taht were on the oem shafts...

I bought this 60 for $950 shipped to my door because I could not find a rear 60 in any of my local wrecking yards for under $500. The same with the front, so I ended up getting that shipped in as well.

 

[Caleb]

Very good drugs up here!

I would have to buy the center section seperate and have the tubes pushed in, which I'm not setup to do - that $900 is just for the center and tubes. Then I'd have to figure out a way to put spindles on it. The brakes are easy, like you say. As for paying someone to turn the spindles, I can do that myself - I do have the technology! ...I already have to turn the front spindles to run the 35 spline outers there...

It just seems to me that going that route would be more involved than going the other way.

I don't know where you are getting your prices but I hope you're not paying $400 for tubes. You can get the center for $495 with cover from Mad4WD.

Couple other things, fronts do not need to be turned to run 35 spline outers. The rear spindles, how are you going to turn them yourself...how big of a lathe do you have because you'll need to have one big enough for the entire housing. Or you can cut them off, turn them in almost any sized lathe and then weld them back on...BUT in order to weld FF spindles on you need to have the alignment pucks and bar so you can get them straight because with a FF setup it's VERY important to have them 100% straight and true.

So in the end what you're saying is you can't build a Rockcrusher 60 for $900.

 

[Jay5.9L]

With 39"s, a 6 cylinder, and slung under a TJ (not a full size blazer or bronco) what are the chances you will really snap a D60? Your got everything working as is so run the sucker and see what happens. If your still not comfortable get some nice alloy shafts and go wheeling

 

[waynehartwig]

I don't know where you are getting your prices but I hope you're not paying $400 for tubes. You can get the center for $495 with cover from Mad4WD.

Couple other things, fronts do not need to be turned to run 35 spline outers. The rear spindles, how are you going to turn them yourself...how big of a lathe do you have because you'll need to have one big enough for the entire housing. Or you can cut them off, turn them in almost any sized lathe and then weld them back on...BUT in order to weld FF spindles on you need to have the alignment pucks and bar so you can get them straight because with a FF setup it's VERY important to have them 100% straight and true.

So in the end what you're saying is you can't build a Rockcrusher 60 for $900.

The cost of the Rockcrusher is moot and I wouldn't care if it was $50. This was already discussed in another thread, and I was told by many, not to put a HPD60 in the rear if I wanted to run big tires.

I have a very large lathe. Way bigger than that 'little' D60.

I also have a narrowing jig to line everything up if I needed to.

According to what I read on Billavista, there are issues with the Ford spindle. It won't take 35 spline axles without modifications. Chevy/Dodge have no problems.

 

[waynehartwig]

With 39"s, a 6 cylinder, and slung under a TJ (not a full size blazer or bronco) what are the chances you will really snap a D60? Your got everything working as is so run the sucker and see what happens. If your still not comfortable get some nice alloy shafts and go wheeling

That was my original thought... But then I started thinking that I could sell the 30 spline Detroit now as a working unit. If it turns out I am able to break an axle shaft, I would still be replacing it and now tossing it in the trash can. Plus it's always easier to work on your junk before it's under your rig or in the shop, than on the trails in the mud....So maybe if I keep the 30 spline axles, I'll just go with some better alloy shafts from the get go and see what happens....

 

[Caleb]

The cost of the Rockcrusher is moot and I wouldn't care if it was $50. This was already discussed in another thread, and I was told by many, not to put a HPD60 in the rear if I wanted to run big tires.

I have a very large lathe. Way bigger than that 'little' D60.

I also have a narrowing jig to line everything up if I needed to.

According to what I read on Billavista, there are issues with the Ford spindle. It won't take 35 spline axles without modifications. Chevy/Dodge have no problems.

You're the one that brought up the Rockcrusher, I was just pointing out your flawed logic.

There is no "issue" with the ford spindles. I assume you are talking front right now, all you need to do for the front is get the correct outer. You do not need to bore the front spindles. I would like to see a single reference saying you have to bore the front spindles...

 

[I Lean]

According to what I read on Billavista, there are issues with the Ford spindle. It won't take 35 spline axles without modifications. Chevy/Dodge have no problems.

The only "issue" is that you can't put a chevy-length outer into a Ford spindle without cutting approximately 5/8" off the length of the shaft. The spindle itself needs zero modification.

I ran cut-to-length GM-style Spicer outers for a while in my Ford D60, then bought those Yukon alloy outer stubs from you that were already the correct length.

 

[waynehartwig]

You're the one that brought up the Rockcrusher, I was just pointing out your flawed logic.

There is no "issue" with the ford spindles. I assume you are talking front right now, all you need to do for the front is get the correct outer. You do not need to bore the front spindles. I would like to see a single reference saying you have to bore the front spindles...

Actually, it wasn't me... Someone else started that tangent Since the other thread, I've always known I was doing a LPD60 in the rear.... I might go with a Spidertrax 9" and True Hi9 later, but that's too much $'s right now with everything else I'm doing.

 

[waynehartwig]

The only "issue" is that you can't put a chevy-length outer into a Ford spindle without cutting approximately 5/8" off the length of the shaft. The spindle itself needs zero modification.

I ran cut-to-length GM-style Spicer outers for a while in my Ford D60, then bought those Yukon alloy outer stubs from you that were already the correct length.

Maybe this was all Billavista was refferencing.... That would be nice if so

So is the rear FFD60 spindle going to be ok if I go 35 spline there as well? Or will that need to be modified?

 

[Caleb]

I can build my own Rockcrusher high clearance HP axle for about $900 that would have 3"x.50" 4130 or 1026 tubes.

Actually, it wasn't me... Someone else started that tangent

So is the rear FFD60 spindle going to be ok if I go 35 spline there as well? Or will that need to be modified?

As already covered many times over in ALL of your threads, you will have to bore out the rear spindles to ~1.6". There is a factory D60 axle out there that has the larger bore but they are very few and far between and there is no rhyme or reason to what they came in so getting one is a crap shoot at best.

Your D60 threads are all just starting to sound like a bunch of broken records. I bet if you go back and read your very first D60 thread all this info is in it.

 

[waynehartwig]

As already covered many times over in ALL of your threads, you will have to bore out the rear spindles to ~1.6". There is a factory D60 axle out there that has the larger bore but they are very few and far between and there is no rhyme or reason to what they came in so getting one is a crap shoot at best.

Your D60 threads are all just starting to sound like a bunch of broken records. I bet if you go back and read your very first D60 thread all this info is in it.

If you go back, Jay5.9L was the first to bring up an aftermarket D60 and asked if I compared one of those to doing it myself. To you!

And as for repeating myself, it's because some give one answer and others give another, while neither are wrong, they are confusing because they come from different directions. I'm just getting facts straight. This thread is about if I should go 35 or 40 spline if I was to upgrade my 30 spline axles. It has nothing to do with anything else. Another thread I was trying to decide which rear axle to run and the D60 prevailed. Another thread I was asking about changing to 5 on 5.5 to a HPD44 in the front, and the D60 prevailed again. All of the threads I have started were specific and none of them have covered the pros-cons to putting either 35 or 40 spline axles in a FFD60. It's not my fault you are posting the same answer to several different questions.

 

[Caleb]

let me help ya out-

From Meat_

From I Lean

From I Lean AGAIN

Again from I Lean

Here's I Lean telling you the front outers will slip right in.

Here's mbryson telling you the same.

And from me

This was from going through ONE of your threads, I'm sure there are others. I love the tech but it gets old when it's the same person asking the same (or very similar) questions and getting the same info on every thread.

 

[thenag]

Only problem with 40 spline shafts is your limited options for a locker... you have a spool and... a spool.

The rear Dana 60 I'll be using in my project has 40 spline shafts & a spool. Yeah it's overkill, but the complete geared, assembled axle with disc brakes & all was as much as a new Detroit, so I bought it.

If your still interested in 40 spline parts, Mark Williams makes some pretty cool parts. That's what's in my rear 60.

Just for sh!ts & giggles, heres 40 compared to 35 spline shafts. -

how do those compare to a 14 bolt shaft?

 

[thenag]

Just like it says... Should I go 35 or 40 splines? Since I have to build this thing from ground up anyway.... Right now it has 30 spline with Detroit and I doubt that will be able to handle 39" tires, right?

40 spline would be a custom shaft, too, correct? Honestly I haven't looked...Just came to mind at the time of this posting...

I do know ARB doesn't make a 40 spline locker, so I would be 'stuck' with a Detroit.

me thinks the itty bitty d60 ring and pinion would blow up long befor the 40 spline stuff.

i have heard of full size guys running 35 spline d60 rears, most of them still end up swapping to a 14 bolt or a 70.

nathan

 

[Greg]

how do those compare to a 14 bolt shaft?

Well, 14 Bolt shafts are 1.5" and 30 spline, so you get the mass with a smaller spline count than a Dana 60, 35 spline shaft. Those Mark Williams axles are 40 spline & nearly 1.75", so more splines & a larger shaft. As far as breakage #'s, I don't know.