Five mile pass death
- Thread starter NoTrax
- Start date
- Location
- Smithfield Utah
Thursty
Well-Known Member
- Location
- Green River
Horrible.
jeep-N-montero
Formerly black_ZJ
- Location
- Bountiful
Tragic indeed and could have easily been avoided, they need to charge the woman with neglect or endangering the safety of a child, especially if it turns out he didn't have a helmet on. Pisses me off when I'm up AF Canyon and I see parents allowing their kids to ride without one on. Last year we watched a 4-wheeler try a steep climb with a father and young daughter on it, he dumped it and it rolled 3 times, luckily he grabbed her and they jumped off the uphill side. They did have helmets on but still could have been hurt. Also watched a guy on a KTM dump it in the same spot.
I know this may be insulting to some of you on here (although it shouldn't be since I'm not referring to you) but I've never lived anywhere that has so many people acting poorly offroad with little regard for safety and little regard for the trail/environment.
Earlier this year I watched a woman in Moab with a ~ 7 year old on the back try riding up an extremely steep climb (doubt she could have made it up it alone and leaning forward) with a bump at the bottom. She went up and of course it came back on her and the kid. I honestly expected to see the kids neck snapped but somehow (he must have been made of rubber) he was ok.
I've seen it countless times.
No helmet(s) - Check (not this time thankfully, but I've seen it plenty of times)
Woman rider with very little experience - Check
Kid riding on the back - Check
Riding up trails beyond your skill level with a kid on the back - Check
I've seen countless other examples of pure stupidity since moving here less than a year ago. In fact I'd go as far as to say I've seen more examples like the one above in the past six months than I have in the past decade of wheeling in Idaho, Nevada and California.
So instead of just me ranting, what's the solution? Education? I certainly don't like getting the Govt involved but if accidents like this keep happening you KNOW someone is going to require an OHV drivers license or course you have to take etc.
It's an extremely tragic event that could have easily been prevented. My condolences to the family and friends of the poor child.
I think as a community we need to be better at policing ourselves. Yes, I know I come off as a dick when I talk with random people on the trail about their actions but I don't care, safety comes first, followed by respecting the rules of the trail you're riding.
Earlier this year I watched a woman in Moab with a ~ 7 year old on the back try riding up an extremely steep climb (doubt she could have made it up it alone and leaning forward) with a bump at the bottom. She went up and of course it came back on her and the kid. I honestly expected to see the kids neck snapped but somehow (he must have been made of rubber) he was ok.
I've seen it countless times.
No helmet(s) - Check (not this time thankfully, but I've seen it plenty of times)
Woman rider with very little experience - Check
Kid riding on the back - Check
Riding up trails beyond your skill level with a kid on the back - Check
I've seen countless other examples of pure stupidity since moving here less than a year ago. In fact I'd go as far as to say I've seen more examples like the one above in the past six months than I have in the past decade of wheeling in Idaho, Nevada and California.
So instead of just me ranting, what's the solution? Education? I certainly don't like getting the Govt involved but if accidents like this keep happening you KNOW someone is going to require an OHV drivers license or course you have to take etc.
It's an extremely tragic event that could have easily been prevented. My condolences to the family and friends of the poor child.
I think as a community we need to be better at policing ourselves. Yes, I know I come off as a dick when I talk with random people on the trail about their actions but I don't care, safety comes first, followed by respecting the rules of the trail you're riding.
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- Location
- Sandy, Ut
All perspective, I've spent a fair amount of time touring all over the west... idiots and their unfortunate offspring are every where. Utah had a very successful 'Know Before You Go' program as well as a youth ATV program but unless parent embrace it, children will still ride sans helmets.
JL Rockies
Binders Fulla Expo
- Location
- Draper
You lost me when you posted peeps from CA had a sense of responsiblity. Another perspective is the peeps were from Eagle Mntn so they were probably Californians. Poor kid.
Can anyone find statistics. I call complete BS on Utah having more offroad and or OHV related accidents per capita than California.
Where I lived at in the Cali desert we had flatlanders (LA area people) come out to the desert and ride of cliffs and into mineshafts all the time. Stupid people with more money than sense and usually alcohol involved. Not saying that was the tragic case this time. But Cali really has more than their share of idiots too. Just sayin' Ozzy.
An OHV license is already required for people underage and it's suggested for everyone else. So what's your point?
As for lots of idiots here, there sure are, but there is no way any place can top California for idiots.
I think the more important comment made by ozzy was "what's the solution? Education?" or "I think as a community we need to be better at policing ourselves."
We really should be helping others to understand safety and responsible use.. But what is the best way?
We really should be helping others to understand safety and responsible use.. But what is the best way?
- Location
- Sandy, Ut
Join Trail Patrol or Right Trail folks, all the tools are already in place... they just need to be implemented.
I can certainly see this! Northern CA's a bit different than LA, basically a completely different state but unfortunately those of us from the northern part of the state get lumped in with LA.
I was only commenting on what I've seen so far and that might not represent the overall climate accurately. No statistics and also no reason for defensiveness. I swear some people on here has such thin skins.
NoTrax said:
I can guarantee that Utah has higher offroad accidents per capita than California... but that's going to be skewed because of the much higher percentage of people here that go offroad.
Chevycrew said:
Yep!
I think the community policing itself is the biggest thing. Too often I've watched people here and elsewhere, turn a blind eye to dangerous behavior, destruction of trails, and overall poor trail etiquette.
I can guarantee that Utah has higher offroad accidents per capita than California... but that's going to be skewed because of the much higher percentage of people here that go offroad.
You do understand what per capita means? Accidents per xxx,xxx people. It allows for percentages to not be overwhelmed by sheer numbers. California has far more OHV penetration than Utah. As well as more parks, and off-road avenues. Just because we have Moab, doesn't mean We have more off-road usage. Our winters alone in this geographical state will limit the amount of overall OHV. We do have snowmobiling but at a insignificant rate compared to 4 wheelers and motorcycles.
This discussion was about an accident pertaining to a 4 wheeler. You claim Utah has less off-road education leading to more accidents. If this is true, someone please prove it.... Anyone
It's always fun to ruffle your feathers. Per capita numbers are completely dependent upon what you're measuring, you should have learned that in statistics.
CA population vs UT population? CA OHV users vs UT OHV users. CA OHV hours ridden vs UT OHV hours ridden. See how it can get complex, and see how the paragraph you wrote above actually undermines your argument? Total number of reported deaths involving ATV's for Utah in the past 20 years is 175, total for CA is 560. Given those numbers CA seems MUCH safer than Utah on the surface... (I need the pot stirring smiley from pbb).
What's funny is instead of looking at the subject objectively several RME members continually get butt hurt over any observation that makes Utah seem like anything less than paradise. Personally I LOVE it here so far. I think it's a great state and I plan on staying quite awhile.
You should really take a reading comprehension class at your local community college.
I never stated a causal relationship between off-road education or lack thereof and accidents. I certainly never said that "Utah has less off-road education leading to more accidents". I merely asked if it was a problem and if further education would help. In fact if you had read my posts you would have seen "policing ourselves" as my answer.
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It's always fun to ruffle your feathers. Per capita numbers are completely dependent upon what you're measuring, you should have learned that in statistics.
Total number of reported deaths involving ATV's for Utah in the past 20 years is 175, total for CA is 560. Given those numbers CA seems MUCH safer than Utah on the surface... (I need the pot stirring smiley from pbb).
What's funny is instead of looking at the subject objectively several RME members continually get butt hurt over any observation that makes Utah seem like anything less than paradise. Personally I LOVE it here so far. I think it's a great state and I plan on staying quite awhile.
You should really take a reading comprehension class at your local community college.
Shall we have a poll on who would prefer your posts to be on another board? Say pirate?