Obama is way ahead...

[cruiseroutfit]

Oh, and under what adminstration did they close a majority of the trails in Moab?

LOL, your obviously really up to speed with the RMP process. Do you know why the anti-motorized crowd is more irked than than the motorized community? Sure you do lol but lets talk about it anyway. Had the RMP's been organized and decided during our apparently future government, our losses would have been tenfold, likely verbatim to the SUWA alternative proposals. The new RMP's are completely acceptable in 95% of the overall integrity. There are minor issues to work around, But you knew that Anti-motorized enviros consider the plans 25% OK, I feel we actually won.

To answer the question, Clinton I beleive. Prior to that the majority of the area was open to cross-country travel. I feel that was the largest closure of land access in the area.

 

[Greg]

Oh, and under what adminstration did they close a majority of the trails in Moab?

I take it you're not familiar with the Grand Staircase-Escalante National Monument? Clinton created 1.9 Million acres of Wilderness in Southern UT. And he made the dedication from Arizona, because NOBODY in Utah's government supported the idea. Clinton did this under the guise of the Antiquities Act, which is meant to preserve Native American ruins and artifacts. Really, who is going to hike to see 1.9 Million acres of land? Not me... you?

The Antiquities Act was supposed to preserve small sites, not Millions of acres of land. Clinton bent over UT and didn't even have the Balls to hold the designation in the actual state that it effected.

 

[Tacoma]

Kurt beat me to it.

EDIT: and Greg rounded it out.

 

[GOAT]

LOL, your obviously really up to speed with the RMP process. Do you know why the anti-motorized crowd is more irked than than the motorized community? Sure you do lol but lets talk about it anyway. Had the RMP's been organized and decided during our apparently future government, our losses would have been tenfold, likely verbatim to the SUWA alternative proposals. The new RMP's are completely acceptable in 95% of the overall integrity. There are minor issues to work around, But you knew that Anti-motorized enviros consider the plans 25% OK, I feel we actually won.

To answer the question, Clinton I beleive. Prior to that the majority of the area was open to cross-country travel. I feel that was the largest closure of land access in the area.

been to the meetings, heard the stats. fantastic. The same amount will be closed regardless. The 4x4 crowd does not have commitment nor the funding to change it.

 

[Tacoma]

Maybe so, but an all-Dem Gubmint will hasten the plot along a little quicker.

 

[GOAT]

Oh, and your right. I was in Texas, with NO public land and paying to have just as much fun offroading as here

 

[GOAT]

Should we expect to see a groundswell of support and funding for places like area BFE in the next couple of months then?

 

[Tacoma]

I would say that free access to more is much better than paying for less.

Ask the East Coast. Tellico? Rausch Creek? Where do you go in New England again?

 

[mbryson]

been to the meetings, heard the stats. fantastic. The same amount will be closed regardless. The 4x4 crowd does not have commitment nor the funding to change it.

Sadly accurate

 

[Tacoma]

Very sadly accurate.

 

[Greg]

Oh, and your right. I was in Texas, with NO public land and paying to have just as much fun offroading as here

So we should just concede and give up the public land that we do still have here?

 

[cruiseroutfit]

been to the meetings, heard the stats. fantastic. The same amount will be closed regardless. The 4x4 crowd does not have committment nor the funding to change it.

Your benighted logic on the AWRA is apparent here. It has been fought off in part by motorized users since 1989. Its not just about 4x4 users, though your right if they were all as dooming as yourself we would be a lost cause. With democrat control of Congress and the Whitehouse, it could pass without any support from Utah and surrounding states.

 

[mbryson]

Oh, and your right. I was in Texas, with NO public land and paying to have just as much fun offroading as here

Yippee....we get to be like somewhere else.

 

[GOAT]

I would say that free access to more is much better than paying for less.

Ask the East Coast. Tellico? Rausch Creek? Where do you go in New England again?

agreed, but consider the vast amount of useless land in the west compared to the east coast. apples oranges.

 

[Tacoma]

Your benighted logic on the AWRA is apparent here. It has been fought off in part by motorized users since 1989. Its not just about 4x4 users, though your right if they were all as dooming as yourself we would be a lost cause. With democrat control of Congress and the Whitehouse, it could pass without any support from Utah and surrounding states.

...and there's "the other shoe"

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Oh, and your right. I was in Texas, with NO public land and paying to have just as much fun offroading as here

That would be your opinion... we obviously enjoy different types of wheeling. The type I most often enjoy can't be had in Texas. And thats the type I'm not willing to lose at the whim of back east special interests. Glad everyone doesn't share your apathy.

agreed, but consider the vast amount of useless land in the west compared to the east coast. apples oranges.

Where exactly is this useless land???

 

[GOAT]

Hey, wait a second! we already have a land thread in chit chat! I digress


back to arguing about the presidency:greg:

 

[unltd1]

Red Rock Wilderness Act? I did some research and found this information...

"The bill has been introduced in Congress every session since 1989 when the late Rep. Wayne Owens, D-Utah, a fierce wilderness advocate, was its primary sponsor. Hinchey took up sponsorship in 1993, and Durbin became the Senate sponsor in 1997."

As of 2007, it's never once made it out of committee. A vast majority of bills die in committee, as this bill has done year after year after year after year after year............in both Democrat AND Republican controlled Congress....

According to the Deseret News, "The entire Utah delegation opposes the bill, and, historically, Congress never passes wilderness legislation over the objection of the home-state delegation."

Ergo, Barack Obama can't take away Utah trails....

Maybe there's something more that I'm not seeing, but everything I'm reading as far as the actual Act shows that it's never come close to actually happening.

I too come from a state where you pay to play. Big whoop. As much as the people here whine about hand outs and freebies, they certainly aren't above crying about the PUBLIC land that they play on FOR FREE.....there are bigger things than our hobbies......

 

[Greg]

Hey, wait a second! we already have a land thread in chit chat! I digress


back to arguing about the presidency:greg:

New presidency = our future land use. You started it.

 

[Tacoma]

See again: Escalante