Question for gun folks...

[jeeper]

Not to poke the bear again...

But this is another story that shows statistically older male violence is work place related.

Suspect in shootings at Half Moon Bay farms was employee, due in court Wednesday

Officials say an agricultural worker killed seven people in back-to-back shootings at two mushroom farms that employed him in Northern California, and the massacre is believed to be a

www.ksl.com

 

[jeeper]

One more non-old white cowboy shooting.

This one is (sarcastic surprise face on) minority minors in West Valley City. ...Gasp... Who could have guess that..

4 teens charged with murdering 15-year-old after luring him to neighborhood

A group of teen gang members were charged Wednesday with murder and accused of luring a 15-year-old boy to a West Valley street, then shooting his car more than 20 times.

www.ksl.com

 

[N-Smooth]

I feel bad that those kids had an upbringing (or lack thereof) that would make such decisions seem acceptable.

 

[jeeper]

I don’t want to go down too many rabbit holes… But over the last couple of years, my eyes have really been opened to the facts that
1-a kid is going to do what a kid is going to do, and a parent can only help steer so much of that direction. Friends and school become a bigger influence as they get older.
2-parents, for the most part are incredibly uninvolved with their kids. The amount of not caring that school teachers and other responsible adults have to deal with is unreal.

There are so many good people and parents on this forum that I think we sometimes take it for granted that the general population is the same way. They simply are not.

 

[pennsylvaniaboy]

One more non-old white cowboy shooting.

This one is (sarcastic surprise face on) minority minors in West Valley City. ...Gasp... Who could have guess that..

4 teens charged with murdering 15-year-old after luring him to neighborhood

A group of teen gang members were charged Wednesday with murder and accused of luring a 15-year-old boy to a West Valley street, then shooting his car more than 20 times.

www.ksl.com

That reads straight hoodrat/cartel kids behavior.....

 

[JL Rockies]

Two of the cornerstones of our great republic:
The right to keep and bear arms
The right to mind your own business.

 

[jeeper]

Man suspected of killing 5 of his neighbors in Texas arrested

A Texas sheriff tells say the man suspected of killing five of his neighbors, including a 9-year-old, has been taken into custody following a days-long manhunt. The man's wife and several other people were also arrested.

www.ksl.com

Article states:

'Mexican national who has been deported four times between 2009 and 2016, according to U.S. immigration officials'

'Capers said that prior to Friday's shooting deputies had been called to the suspect's house at least one other time previously over shooting rounds in his yard.'

So once again, we are aware of an illegal person, continuously breaking the law. Been in trouble before for firearms discharge. No consequences for breaking the law.. now a mass murderer.

White Cis male not the problem, again.

 

[mbryson]

Man suspected of killing 5 of his neighbors in Texas arrested

A Texas sheriff tells say the man suspected of killing five of his neighbors, including a 9-year-old, has been taken into custody following a days-long manhunt. The man's wife and several other people were also arrested.

www.ksl.com

Article states:

'Mexican national who has been deported four times between 2009 and 2016, according to U.S. immigration officials'

'Capers said that prior to Friday's shooting deputies had been called to the suspect's house at least one other time previously over shooting rounds in his yard.'

So once again, we are aware of an illegal person, continuously breaking the law. Been in trouble before for firearms discharge. No consequences for breaking the law.. now a mass murderer.

White Cis male not the problem, again.

...but if there was another law we'd be doing SOMETHING

 

[Houndoc]

Man suspected of killing 5 of his neighbors in Texas arrested

A Texas sheriff tells say the man suspected of killing five of his neighbors, including a 9-year-old, has been taken into custody following a days-long manhunt. The man's wife and several other people were also arrested.

www.ksl.com

Article states:

'Mexican national who has been deported four times between 2009 and 2016, according to U.S. immigration officials'

'Capers said that prior to Friday's shooting deputies had been called to the suspect's house at least one other time previously over shooting rounds in his yard.'

So once again, we are aware of an illegal person, continuously breaking the law. Been in trouble before for firearms discharge. No consequences for breaking the law.. now a mass murderer.

White Cis male not the problem, again.

BS to be deflecting this to anything to do with race or immigration status.

 

[jeeper]

BS to be deflecting this to anything to do with race or immigration status.

Totally not BS. Shows that people who do illegal things are going to continue to do illegal things. Deported multiple times and still comes back proves that laws don’t apply to him. Already in trouble for shooting in his yard, but no change in behavior. Ban the AR15, make magazine capacity laws, background check laws, etc, and this home boy won’t care anymore than he already doesn’t.

Additionally, Your average Joe illegal doesn't get deported, let alone multiple times. This guy must have been a problem for a long time.
The point is, until the current laws are upheld and followed up on, new gun laws and restrictions do nothing but punish those willing to follow them.

 

[Houndoc]

Totally not BS. Shows that people who do illegal things are going to continue to do illegal things. Deported multiple times and still comes back proves that laws don’t apply to him. Already in trouble for shooting in his yard, but no change in behavior. Ban the AR15, make magazine capacity laws, background check laws, etc, and this home boy won’t care anymore than he already doesn’t.

Additionally, Your average Joe illegal doesn't get deported, let alone multiple times. This guy must have been a problem for a long time.
The point is, until the current laws are upheld and followed up on, new gun laws and restrictions do nothing but punish those willing to follow them.

The fact that he was in trouble multiple times for shooting in his yard is a very key part of the puzzle indeed, especially since that appears to be the trigger of the conflict.

Did any of those previous run-ins with the law over shooting in his yard result in criminal charges? I am guessing not. Even if they had, would they have been serious enough (felony) to prevent legal gun ownership? Is it reasonable to draw one of the lines related to gun ownership at not allowing legal gun ownership by someone who has repeatedly been in trouble for shooting in their yard?

If we are going to trace any behavior course to see what could have prevented the murders, I would say that is the path to examine, not his immigration status.

 

[Stephen]

The fact that he was in trouble multiple times for shooting in his yard is a very key part of the puzzle indeed, especially since that appears to be the trigger of the conflict.

Did any of those previous run-ins with the law over shooting in his yard result in criminal charges? I am guessing not. Even if they had, would they have been serious enough (felony) to prevent legal gun ownership? Is it reasonable to draw one of the lines related to gun ownership at not allowing legal gun ownership by someone who has repeatedly been in trouble for shooting in their yard?

If we are going to trace any behavior course to see what could have prevented the murders, I would say that is the path to examine, not his immigration status.

Illegal aliens legally can't own guns. Had immigration laws been enforced, he wouldn't have been able to illegally acquire a firearm in the United States and illegally discharge it in his front yard and then illegally murder his neighbors for complaining about his illegal behavior. Just throwing that out there.

 

[anderson750]

Illegal aliens legally can't own guns. Had immigration laws been enforced, he wouldn't have been able to illegally acquire a firearm in the United States and illegally discharge it in his front yard and then illegally murder his neighbors for complaining about his illegal behavior. Just throwing that out there.

You are using the illegal a lot in the reply…….you racist.

Let’s be honest….the first law he broke was by being here illegally. If it wasn’t so easy for him to illegally come back into the country then this probably would never have happened.

 

[glockman]

The fact that he was in trouble multiple times for shooting in his yard is a very key part of the puzzle indeed, especially since that appears to be the trigger of the conflict.

Did any of those previous run-ins with the law over shooting in his yard result in criminal charges? I am guessing not. Even if they had, would they have been serious enough (felony) to prevent legal gun ownership? Is it reasonable to draw one of the lines related to gun ownership at not allowing legal gun ownership by someone who has repeatedly been in trouble for shooting in their yard?

If we are going to trace any behavior course to see what could have prevented the murders, I would say that is the path to examine, not his immigration status.

I don't understand your logic here. Illegal gun ownership is the focus, not illegal presence where the crime took place? If either crime had been prosecuted, the murders would not have happened. Many illegal immigrant's only commit minor crimes after entering the country illegally. If you don't think that is the case, talk to anyone who works for the State ORS or DFS. A large portion of their workload is dealing with undocumented people who are illegally manipulating the system. At minimum, many of the people here illegally are committing fraud, using other people's social security numbers. These are not victimless crimes but many people see it as racist to even mention this. You can be sympathetic to people wanting a better life while still expecting innocent people who were born here to be protected from being victims of identity theft or in this case being murdered.

 

[Houndoc]

I don't understand your logic here. Illegal gun ownership is the focus, not illegal presence where the crime took place? If either crime had been prosecuted, the murders would not have happened. Many illegal immigrant's only commit minor crimes after entering the country illegally. If you don't think that is the case, talk to anyone who works for the State ORS or DFS. A large portion of their workload is dealing with undocumented people who are illegally manipulating the system. At minimum, many of the people here illegally are committing fraud, using other people's social security numbers. These are not victimless crimes but many people see it as racist to even mention this. You can be sympathetic to people wanting a better life while still expecting innocent people who were born here to be protected from being victims of identity theft or in this case being murdered.

Focusing on immigration status misses the bigger picture.
Contrary to some in the media, undocumented immigrants do not commit more violent crime. And most (obviously not all) mass shootings are native born citizens.
There is more potential to prevent violent crime focusing on factors aside from immigration status ( as I said including his other gun related run ins with the law.)
But that does take a willingness to look at gun ownership restrictions.

 

[Herzog]

Oh.

 

[jeeper]

🧐

 

[glockman]

Focusing on immigration status misses the bigger picture.
Contrary to some in the media, undocumented immigrants do not commit more violent crime. And most (obviously not all) mass shootings are native born citizens.
There is more potential to prevent violent crime focusing on factors aside from immigration status ( as I said including his other gun related run ins with the law.)
But that does take a willingness to look at gun ownership restrictions.

Fair enough. Most mass shootings are carried out by 100% law abiding citizens with nothing more than a traffic ticket. Seems like most people focus on the presence of the gun, how it got there and how it could be restricted. I would say the same scrutiny should be applied to the person using the gun.

Gun ownership restrictions will be exactly like COVID restrictions. An ounce of prevention will cause 10 pounds of harm, both intended and unintended.

 

[jeeper]

View attachment 159568
View attachment 159569

Oh.

Discharged from the military for mental health issues.
I wonder how many current laws were not followed to allow this man the ability to do what he did.

 

[jeeper]

Another time that the government failed to prevent an issue.
Had the on-books laws and rules been followed, the Maine shooting would have been prevented.
Making me give my son a background check before I give him his own gun won't solve ignoring mental health issues in other people.

Maine mass shooter had numerous run-ins with authorities, warning signs before shooting

Maine's authorities are trying to piece together the events that led to the worst mass shooting in the state's history. Those same authorities are also facing growing scrutiny on the shooter.

www.ksl.com