Camping tips:The Sleeping bag

[Cascadia]

That's an awesome idea. My feet are always the first thing to freeze and the last thing to thaw out.

 

[Kevin B.]

I bought a fleece liner that adds ~12° to that.

Which liner did you buy? I bought the cheap one at Recreation Outlet, but I don't know exactly what rating that's supposed to add to my bag.

 

[sixstringsteve]

Holler if anyone sees a great deal on lightweight down pants.

hm... maybe I could just use down pants and a down parka inside my 30* bag. I wonder what temps I could handle like that. Goosefeet custom-builds down pants to your size, and they're lighter and warmer than WM pants (and slightly cheaper I hear).

 

[mesha]

Great idea. I think it'd be cool cuz then I'd have two different bags to choose from depending on conditions.

My 30* bag weighs 1 lb 7 oz. If I added a zpacks 10* medium wide quilt (1lb 5 oz), I'd still be under 3 lbs combined, and I would imagine I could take that setup down to about -5 to -10*.

It will work really well. I use my quilts in combination often. We also throw a thermarest ventra over the kids when the temperature drops to bump the rating of their sleeping bags.

I would make your Zpacks quilt at least 1 size bigger than you think you need. Especially if you are going to layer them. You will be 4 inches fatter all around if you are layering. Try my quilt if you haven't already to make sure you get the right size.

That's an awesome idea. My feet are always the first thing to freeze and the last thing to thaw out.

Are you sleeping in clean loose fitting sleep socks? If not give that a try. Also, some nice down booties/socks can really help out.

Which liner did you buy? I bought the cheap one at Recreation Outlet, but I don't know exactly what rating that's supposed to add to my bag.

Any cheap fleece will do the trick. Adds about 10-15 degrees to a sleeping bag depending on the quality of the fleece. fleece bags/blankets are often used as a "filler". Taking up the space on the inside of you bag with a blanket will slow down the heat pumping effect of moving around and having warm air "swoosh" out past you face.

 

[MOODY]

Before I bought down booties I would zip up my down coat, pull the sleeves inside itself and then stick my feet inside the arms of the coat. Never had cold feet that way.

 

[mesha]

hm... maybe I could just use down pants and a down parka inside my 30* bag. I wonder what temps I could handle like that. Goosefeet custom-builds down pants to your size, and they're lighter and warmer than WM pants (and slightly cheaper I hear).

That would be a very effective idea. I use synthetic fills pants and a down jacket as cold weather sleep wear.

Goosefeet makes some killer stuff. I will be ordering their down socks here in the near future. Unfortunately, you will not be able to get any pants until the seamstress is back from maternity leave. Worth the weight though. Next best would be the WM flash pants.

 

[sixstringsteve]

Does anyone have a WM Lynx bag? I'd like to see one in person to see what it's like.

 

[sixstringsteve]

Goosefeet makes some killer stuff. I will be ordering their down socks here in the near future. Unfortunately, you will not be able to get any pants until the seamstress is back from maternity leave. Worth the weight though. Next best would be the WM flash pants.

Good to know. I like the way the WM flight pants look. I'd use the reinforced seat and knee areas, but not the full-length zipper. Why do these pants have a full-length zipper? Is it so you can put the pants on without having to take off your boots?

 

[sixstringsteve]

Has anyone tried the Wm flight pants before? I'm curious if the side zippers would be uncomfortable when side-sleeping.

 

[DOSS]

Has anyone tried the Wm flight pants before? I'm curious if the side zippers would be uncomfortable when side-sleeping.

I haven't had the WM flight pants before but I have had others and the zippers drove me nutz YMMV but I am picky when it comes to zippers and such and sleeping on them... (zippers are for easy removal without removing boots and crampons as you said earlier)

 

[sixstringsteve]

Thanks Doss. I don't plan on hiking or climbing in them, so I'll be looking for something without zippers. Do you think I could take my 30* bag down to 10* with some good down pants and a down jacket? If so, that might negate the need for a winter-specific bag. Plus I can be warm around camp when i'm not in my bag.

 

[DOSS]

Thanks Doss. I don't plan on hiking or climbing in them, so I'll be looking for something without zippers. Do you think I could take my 30* bag down to 10* with some good down pants and a down jacket? If so, that might negate the need for a winter-specific bag. Plus I can be warm around camp when i'm not in my bag.

I think you could pull it off.. problem would arise if you are doing much that will cause you to sweat during the day and then trying to sleep in potentially damp down pants/jacket you will end up freezing your butt clean off. I have seen it work for some people and have slept in down pants jacket that I have worn during the day but make sure that you put on a dry layer under them before sleeping and then in the morning otherwise sweat compounds and they become useless. ... I prefer a day system and a night system so that I don't have the potential of insulation layer failure.

 

[sixstringsteve]

I stay plenty warm in my merino leggings during the day. It doesn't feel like it, but I imagine I could end up with some sweat on them. The down pants would only be worn around camp and sleeping, where I'm not doing anything to work up a sweat. It sounds like if I swap out my wet wool base layer for dry ones I should be good.

 

[mesha]

I stay plenty warm in my merino leggings during the day. It doesn't feel like it, but I imagine I could end up with some sweat on them. The down pants would only be worn around camp and sleeping, where I'm not doing anything to work up a sweat. It sounds like if I swap out my wet wool base layer for dry ones I should be good.

If anything will keep you warm when wet it is merino wool.

 

[sixstringsteve]

Davy, when you winter camp, do you change your base layer before going to bed? If I go to bed with sweaty merino i imagine all that vapor will have to pass through my bag to its shell. It seems warmer to put a dry base layer on, but this is just my armchair quarterback logic speaking. What do you think?

 

[mesha]

Davy, when you winter camp, do you change your base layer before going to bed? If I go to bed with sweaty merino i imagine all that vapor will have to pass through my bag to its shell. It seems warmer to put a dry base layer on, but this is just my armchair quarterback logic speaking. What do you think?

Switching out is a nice luxury. You are right it is warmer to switch to a dry base layer. If you have the extra layer then go for it. I rarely change my bottoms, usually the top if I change at all. It depends on how long I have at camp before I crawl into the bag. If I have a decent amount of time then the base layer might be dry before I get to bed. In the winter I really try to stay cold while I am moving to avoid as much sweat as possible. If I get too wet during the hike and don't have time to dry out then I like to change. Even if it is just into my sleep jacket with no underwear on. One thing to think about is what you are going to do with the wet undergarment. It will freeze unless it is in your bag with you drying out. At that point you might as well be wearing it. That is one of the great things about having a decent base layer. You have a better chance of staying warm going to bed a little moist than you do with a crappy base layer (i.e regular thermals). I always change my socks.

A lot of it depends on your personal metabolism. You may be better off changing in the night every night if you get easily cold.

 

[sixstringsteve]

I've been trying to dial in my winter sleep setup lately, and I did some more testing last night. I tried out a WM Apache MF 15* bag. I was sleeping in merino wool base layers only and a beanie and wool socks. I slept with my neor air x-therm direcly on the grass. I slept for about 4 hours at 10*, and stayed fairly warm, but after 4 hours I wanted something warmer. I know I could layer my clothing a lot better and get warmer that way, but I think I want an even warmer bag.

I love the cut of the apache, but WM doesn't make a warmer bag in that cut. Once you get warmer bags, the cut starts getting bigger and bigger. I may have to try a Feathered Friends next.

I'm also waking up with a sore throat from breathing cold air all night. Any ideas to remedy this? I may try pulling the bag completely over my head, but I'm worried about condensation buid-up inside my bag.

 

[DAA]

I'm jealous that you have visible grass... Haven't seen any around my place for a month. I hate winter...

You are more than welcome to try my Feathered Friends Swift, but, it's only 20*, and it's their wide version, which I know you don't care for. I do think it is a superb quality bag, on par with the best of the best. My specimen comes in at 33 oz. including a GG cuben/event stuff sack. It's too warm for my typical backpacking trips, which is why I'm looking for a new one for the upcoming season.

- DAA

 

[sixstringsteve]

thanks for the offer Dave. Next time I'm up there I'll take a look at it.

I'm going to order a 10* wide XL zpacks bag today. If I can't sleep through the night in the backyard in it, it'll be going back. I wonder if I have a sleep disorder... I rarely sleep well until the 3rd night when I'm camping.

 

[mesha]

I wonder how a short sleeping bag and a nice down coat would work for me. I Know some mountaineers use a lower body bag and a coat for an emergency bivy. It might work for me. buy a bag that is 5'5" or so and then my nice puffy coat. hmmmmm