Coronavirus
- Thread starter Kevin B.
- Start date
- Location
- Never Far From Nowhere
This is pretty cool:
www.roadandtrack.com
How Ford Is Using Seat Ventilation Fans to Build Thousands of Respirators
An ingenious solution to provide needed aid to frontline emergency workers in the wake of the COVID-19 pandemic.
www.roadandtrack.com
This is pretty cool:
How Ford Is Using Seat Ventilation Fans to Build Thousands of Respirators
An ingenious solution to provide needed aid to frontline emergency workers in the wake of the COVID-19 pandemic.
This is how we win. I love seeing all of the stories on how businesses are offering services or innovating and collaborating to meet needs during this pandemic.
- Location
- Stinkwater
Are you sure that's the case? I agree that misinformation is rife and that's a huge problem for we little people, but the reports I've been reading from individuals in China say that they're all still wearing masks. They say they're allowed to go around their own cities mostly freely now, to work or to the store, etc, but the cities themselves are still locked down with anybody coming from outside forced into a two week isolation quarantine before they're allowed to resume normal life. And that's only been possible because they literally welded people's doors shut, went to an amazingly draconian lockdown, in order to get the infection numbers under control. And it only just happened within the past week, so it's still too early to say if their transmission rates will stay controllable or if they go back up. And plus, it's China, so I'm automatically discounting anything that comes out of that country at this point because they've been lying and making shit up since day one of this virus and they're still doing it.
But yeah. It'd be nice to be able to just have the information at hand and presented clearly instead of having to dig and evaluate each source and etc.
Another reason to flatten the curve is the chance for mutation. Viruses mutate, that is sort of their job without mutation they die out. When they mutate sometimes they get more deadly and sometimes they get less deadly. The number of hosts dying makes zero difference to the virus, it just needs to infect. (if every host dies then nothing is left to infect, but viruses don't think so that isn't part of the biological imperative) If viruses don't mutate then immunity of hosts catches up sooner rather than later. It is most likely that this virus would mutate to be less deadly. Not because it cares, but because it is already pretty deadly or we wouldn't be in this crazy pandemic situation. It is a deadly mutated strain of coronaviridae already. The mutation rate is still being calculated, but early data suggests are that it is not a fast mutating pathogen meaning a long term vaccine is likely. Also, meaning natural immunity will help slow the seasonal transmission. It is likely Covid19 will be back in the fall. Hopefully, natural immunity and a vaccine have time to do their thing by then. If not, maybe it will mutate. It is being very successful right now so it has less biological incentive to mutate. Not because it is thinking, but because of natural selection.
Here are a couple boring articles about mutation in very similar coronaviruses. The one about SARS(heavy reading, but not terrible) which affected people the other is about a feline version (terrible reading) that is much more deadly. Luckily the feline version hasn't made its way to humans yet. The feline article uses the word cleavage quite a bit, but don't get too excited it isn't that kind of cleavage. It might be science nerd clickbait
bmcevolbiol.biomedcentral.com
*** The conclusion from the article if you don't want to read the whole thing
The estimated mutation rate and the synonymous and non-synonymous substitution rates in the SARS-CoV genome were moderate compared to that in coronavirus and other RNA viruses, suggesting that the SARS-CoV is not an unusual coronavirus in terms of its speed of nucleotide or amino acid changes. Based on the mutation rates estimated in this study, the emerging time of the most recent common ancestor of the 16 isolates can be placed between February 2002 and November 2002. This suggests that the SARS-CoV could have been with humans as early as the spring of 2002 without causing a severe epidemic.
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
I understand the idea that a quickly made vaccine is scary(I am leery too), but much of the science is already done. Hopefully, vaccines that have been used for similar coronaviridae can be adapter to fit the situation we are in. It still takes time to get it right, but it isn't like we are starting from scratch. It is too bad funding dried up for the vaccines we were already working on for coronavirus strains.
The reason china is back to normal sooner the the US projection is easy. People got locked away and the military got involved. Murica isn't ready for that level of guberment reach, nor should we be. I am not saying we should all turn in our freedom cards and let the government direct our lives, but in the counties that are more government run a pandemic is easier to contain, assuming the government steps in. We aren't used to being told what to do. Many of us don't want to listen even if the science and data backs it up.
If a military enemy came to America to try to kill us (even if it was mostly sick or elderly people) we would fight with everything we have. We wouldn't hand weapons to the elderly and say stay in your house and fend for yourself, I don't want my routine messed up. This enemy is unseen and since it attacks with an inconvenience we have a hard time banding together to fight it. Our best weapon against this enemy is distance, hygiene, science, and time.
Here are a couple boring articles about mutation in very similar coronaviruses. The one about SARS(heavy reading, but not terrible) which affected people the other is about a feline version (terrible reading) that is much more deadly. Luckily the feline version hasn't made its way to humans yet. The feline article uses the word cleavage quite a bit, but don't get too excited it isn't that kind of cleavage. It might be science nerd clickbait
Moderate mutation rate in the SARS coronavirus genome and its implications - BMC Ecology and Evolution
Background The outbreak of severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) caused a severe global epidemic in 2003 which led to hundreds of deaths and many thousands of hospitalizations. The virus causing SARS was identified as a novel coronavirus (SARS-CoV) and multiple genomic sequences have been...
bmcevolbiol.biomedcentral.com
*** The conclusion from the article if you don't want to read the whole thing
The estimated mutation rate and the synonymous and non-synonymous substitution rates in the SARS-CoV genome were moderate compared to that in coronavirus and other RNA viruses, suggesting that the SARS-CoV is not an unusual coronavirus in terms of its speed of nucleotide or amino acid changes. Based on the mutation rates estimated in this study, the emerging time of the most recent common ancestor of the 16 isolates can be placed between February 2002 and November 2002. This suggests that the SARS-CoV could have been with humans as early as the spring of 2002 without causing a severe epidemic.
Mutation in Spike Protein Cleavage Site and Pathogenesis of Feline Coronavirus - PMC
Feline coronaviruses (FCoV) exist as 2 biotypes: feline enteric coronavirus (FECV) and feline infectious peritonitis virus (FIPV). FECV causes subclinical infections; FIPV causes feline infectious peritonitis (FIP), a systemic and fatal disease. It ...
www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov
I understand the idea that a quickly made vaccine is scary(I am leery too), but much of the science is already done. Hopefully, vaccines that have been used for similar coronaviridae can be adapter to fit the situation we are in. It still takes time to get it right, but it isn't like we are starting from scratch. It is too bad funding dried up for the vaccines we were already working on for coronavirus strains.
The reason china is back to normal sooner the the US projection is easy. People got locked away and the military got involved. Murica isn't ready for that level of guberment reach, nor should we be. I am not saying we should all turn in our freedom cards and let the government direct our lives, but in the counties that are more government run a pandemic is easier to contain, assuming the government steps in. We aren't used to being told what to do. Many of us don't want to listen even if the science and data backs it up.
If a military enemy came to America to try to kill us (even if it was mostly sick or elderly people) we would fight with everything we have. We wouldn't hand weapons to the elderly and say stay in your house and fend for yourself, I don't want my routine messed up. This enemy is unseen and since it attacks with an inconvenience we have a hard time banding together to fight it. Our best weapon against this enemy is distance, hygiene, science, and time.
Veteran-owned shirt company shifts to making masks for doctors and nurses: 'This is not about money'
An Army veteran and the CEO of an apparel company in Georgia who is shifting his operations to make protective masks for doctors and nurses amid the coronavirus outbreak said on “Fox & Friends” on Wednesday that he “needs support.”
www.foxnews.com
- Location
- South Carolina....no public land
Relax Francis, you're actually agreeing with the article and with me with your comments of finding a balance. I have been paying attention to the numbers and I have been doing my part to stay home. I'm not basing my opinion off of anything except reality - eventually (note that I've not specified any timeline, only agreeing that the lockdown / social distancing / quarantine can't last forever) the economy has to get going again.
Someone on a FB thread keeps responding "you can't work if you die", they're right, but how many people are going to die due to complications of a failed economy? I'm with you and everyone else in doing my part, but both realities have to be faced and eventually that balance has to be reached.
And honestly where is the government handout going to come from? Especially on a longer term situation when the unemployment rate increases? Poor management from multiple administrations and congresses (present and past) have left this country in a massive deficit and have farmed out far too much of our manufacturing to other countries.
I don't have the answers - I'm not smart enough to know everything and I don't have all of the smart people around me giving me advice, but we can have a civil discussion, especially when you finish out your thread basically in agreement with my statement.
- Location
- Stinkwater
No, I didn't agree with your sentiment, and you walking your shit back doesn't change that.
I'm all about a civil discussion, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to call out reactionary crap when I see it, and that article that you agreed with is reactionary crap.
I'm all about a civil discussion, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to call out reactionary crap when I see it, and that article that you agreed with is reactionary crap.
glockman
I hate Jeep trucks
- Location
- Pleasant Grove
I am really struggling with this whole thing. For one, a lot of this is just how my family has lived for 10 years with a child with a severe respiratory disease. We wash often, don't go out a lot during flu season and my wife has been working from home for 10 years. I get an IPA mist when I enter the house in the winter and so do all my kids. Our livers and kidneys will give out but we won't get my 9 year old sick. I say this to emphasize that I have A LOT of reason to be cautious.
Now consider that when I say this
Now consider that when I say this
This not a statement coming from logic or reason, but rather emotion. Killing the economy will kill lots of people and cause lots of human suffering. That isn't the answer to resolving human suffering. Shifting the cause from COVID to economic ruin does no one a favor. No one on this board has the information to make concise sound decisions. All we can do is be as cautious as we can be and still be able to live.
Unimog
Eric
- Location
- Stansbury Park, UT
Maybe we can agree that the great strength of our country is in individuals making choices that benefit everyone. My problem is that I haven't heard anyone on or off the list answer the question Kurt is asking. I get it that nobody knows for sure, but therein lies the discomfort. Whether we like it or not, the resources available to solve the problem are driven by our economy. You only have to look at the stock market reaction to both the virus and our national legislators finally acting to do something about it to understand that. If we make choices that drive our economy into the ground, then we will have fewer options with what to do after that.
Please be careful about attempting to categorize me using some kind of political label. Each of us has to decide how to handle this and the conversation and points of view put forth by everyone are valuable. Some might even need to set aside their complete disdain for the president of the US as a person in order to achieve the common good I think we are all searching for.
Please be careful about attempting to categorize me using some kind of political label. Each of us has to decide how to handle this and the conversation and points of view put forth by everyone are valuable. Some might even need to set aside their complete disdain for the president of the US as a person in order to achieve the common good I think we are all searching for.
- Location
- South Carolina....no public land
I get you have strong feelings, I didn't walk anything back. And, your statement about balancing does agree with the sentiment of the article. You don't agree with me, that's fine, no hard feelings. Without re-reading the article I don't recall that he had a specific timeframe for finding that balance. Maybe I'm wrong on that statement, for that I'll apoligize up front.
You want some numbers, here's an interesting website:
https://ourworldindata.org/coronavirus
- Location
- South Carolina....no public land
This has been true for the last three+ years.
And for those who may want to put a political label on me - don't . Labels do no good in any situation as they ALWAYS hinder and / or block discussion.
Curious what the opinionated think about this piece....
news.yahoo.com
Why this Nobel laureate predicts a quicker coronavirus recovery: 'We're going to be fine'
A Nobel laureate predicted China's recovery weeks before it happened. Analyzing the numbers, he sees a much brighter global outcome than many experts.
RME hasn't seen this much action/discussion on anything since other forms of social media came along.
Rocky Mountain Epidemiologists or Rocky Mountain Economists? We should vote.
Curious what the opinionated think about this piece....
Why this Nobel laureate predicts a quicker coronavirus recovery: 'We're going to be fine'
A Nobel laureate predicted China's recovery weeks before it happened. Analyzing the numbers, he sees a much brighter global outcome than many experts.
"The opinionated" is a loaded way to ask. We all have opinions.
The article makes some excellent points. I think most of us on here agree that it is not the end of the world. The HUGE numbers of deaths are unlikely. I read some articles saying it would be as high as 1.7 million in the US alone. I don't think that is reasonable. We did something to contain the spread. What we continue to do will determine the extent.
Even Levitt who says it is not as bad as some people say, agrees with the call of social distancing.
"Levitt said he's in sync with those calling for strong measures to fight the outbreak. The social-distancing mandates are critical — particularly the ban on large gatherings — because the virus is so new that the population has no immunity to it, and a vaccine is still many months away. "This is not the time to go out drinking with your buddies," he said."
I don't know how to balance economy and health and all that. Hopefully, we can trust in smarter people than me to figure out all that stuff.
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johngottfredson
Threat Level Midnight
- Location
- Alpine
I think it’s fun when I see commenters in the media (and here, apparently) point to Trumps wanting to get people back to work before public health experts recommend it, “simply because he’s worried about re-election.” That is, because his motivation is selfish, therefore the action is wrong. Well...yeah, if an economic collapse is ushered in under his watch, he’s definitely not getting the nod a second time. But the key phrase here is ‘economic collapse’.
For those who say economics (and liberties?) be damned, no life can be lost unnecessarily...just recognize that your candidate for president is Bernie Sanders. There is ALWAYS a trade off. ALWAYS. Why don’t we impose 50% taxes across the board so everyone in this country is guaranteed premium medical care no matter what? So yeah, it sucks to be in charge of these decisions right now, but the economic realities of the cure are starting to get real for much of the country, and that trade off that needs to be made is top of mind for everyone.
To dismiss all costs outside of public health concerns is not only nonsense, but is out of touch with the reality of American consciousness. Right or wrong, people won’t stand to lose everything they’ve built in their businesses or their life savings, or watch themselves become dependents of the state.
I certainly don’t have the answers, but both sides of the equation need to be respected.
For those who say economics (and liberties?) be damned, no life can be lost unnecessarily...just recognize that your candidate for president is Bernie Sanders. There is ALWAYS a trade off. ALWAYS. Why don’t we impose 50% taxes across the board so everyone in this country is guaranteed premium medical care no matter what? So yeah, it sucks to be in charge of these decisions right now, but the economic realities of the cure are starting to get real for much of the country, and that trade off that needs to be made is top of mind for everyone.
To dismiss all costs outside of public health concerns is not only nonsense, but is out of touch with the reality of American consciousness. Right or wrong, people won’t stand to lose everything they’ve built in their businesses or their life savings, or watch themselves become dependents of the state.
I certainly don’t have the answers, but both sides of the equation need to be respected.