Heating a Cold Shop?

[jeeper]

I had a wood stove for a few years. I didn't like it much. It took well over an hour just to get it up to heat, it was hard to get the heat to disperse, and it stunk all the time. It never really did get my garage warm. The garage was not insulated, which I am sure added to the cold.
A couple years ago I insulated the ceiling (9ft) and bought a cheap furnace from KSL. I converted the furnace to run on propane, and just hook up a propane bottle. I now have clean, warm air on demand. I should have bought a larger furnace.. but it is sufficient. I am frequently in a t-shirt, while it is below freezing outside.

 

[muleskinner]

I insulated my shop and It's hot in about an hour after starting my heat. The forced air heat exchanger I built makes a huge difference.

 

[glockman]

I installed a mini-split this summer after insulating. It does a pretty nice job of keeping the shop warm- I keep it on it's lowest setting, which is 61F.
Bought the unit from PowerSaveAC.com for $589 with free shipping! Very easy DIY install. I was chillin' at 71F when it was 105F outside this summer.

I'm planning to build a small oil burner stove to augment the mini-split and help me get rid of some waste oil I've accumulated.

how does this do heating the shop? My shop is 1K sq ft and this unit says it is good for 750. $600 is totally reasonable to keep the shop 50 in the winter and under 90 in the summer.

 

[Greg]

My torpedo heater is a 110,000 btu and it gets my 800 sq/ft garage up to t-shirt temps in under 20 minutes, but it's really just the air that's hot at that point. All of the vehicles and the floor are still pretty cold for another 45 minutes of running it.

Jeremy hit on a good point about the air being heated up with the torpedo (and many other similar options). A propane powered ceramic heater puts out Infrared Heat, which heats objects in the area. I've worked in shops that have used these (bigger) and they're awesome. - https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_425107_425107

A 40# propane tank and one of those heaters would burn clean, put out plenty of radiating heat and be easy enough to install and relocate when needed. Of course you'll have to deal with the hassle of filling the tank every now & again. You could look into leasing a larger propane tank and having it filled by the company with a truck, if you want to get real fancy.

Combine that with a smaller work area that has been sectioned off from the remaining large shop and it should be pretty nice.

 

[Gawynz]

This forum is awesome! Thank you for all the ideas and insight.

• Given the feedback, I think I'm going to bail on electric
• The wood stove is a cool thought but where I live I really don't have access to collecting firewood
• The idea of cutting down the volume of the shop and only heat the area I work in is something I'll look into
• The torpedo seems like a good option for pointing in my general direction and getting quick heat, but I'd like to avoid the noise, mess, etc.

I like the idea of propane, seems like a good compromise for cost, cleanliness, and fits my building; plus when I move I can take it with me. There were a few good propane options listed but I really like the idea of an infrared heater like @Greg posted. Heating the air of an uninsulated space seems wasteful, heating the objects that then radiate seems like a better idea. I think this style of heater would also fit well in my shop given the tall rafters; I can angle it to cover my work space as well as the vehicle space for whatever I'm working on. About 1/3 of the building has a second floor, I'm thinking I could put a 100# propane tank up there out of the way and route the lines along the rafters to the heater (have to figure out how to get a filled 175lb tank up the stairs ha). Installing a fan for some forced air venting should be simple enough, along with installing a CO monitor.

Anyone have experience/advice on sizing of a propane infrared heating unit (60k, 100k, 120k BTUs)?

 

[Gravy]

Insulation was the best money I spent on my shop. Comfortable in the summer with a rolling AC unit and winter with a propane heater.

 

[OCNORB]

how does this do heating the shop? My shop is 1K sq ft and this unit says it is good for 750. $600 is totally reasonable to keep the shop 50 in the winter and under 90 in the summer.

It keeps it warm even with these sub-zero nights. I've been leaving it on - justified by the fact that my cordless tool batteries, motorcycle batteries, and paints/chemicals, etc are going to last longer by never getting frozen. I've only gotten the November bill so far and it wasn't much more than last year's November. I'll be keeping an eye on it. I'd really like to add some sort of metering device to my shop sub-panel just to track how much it really costs me.

One other thing- its a nice even heat - no hot draft or fumes. I used to use a propane torpedo, but I had to have the door open or the fumes made me sick. Also, I'm not 100% finished insulating - still need to do the doors and ends of the rafters. Ceiling and walls are done. So it might get cheaper to run.

 

[Mouse]

Insulation was the best money I spent on my shop. Comfortable in the summer with a rolling AC unit and winter with a propane heater.

Insulating garage doors is easy and effective

 

[OCNORB]

I insulated my shop and It's hot in about an hour after starting my heat. The forced air heat exchanger I built makes a huge difference.

That's one of the nicest oil burner builds I've seen!

I can't believe how many people use plastic buckets and pex lines- you did it right!

 

[Gravy]

Insulating garage doors is easy and effective

When I replaced my wood garage door 5 years ago, I paid extra for an insulated door and do not regret it whatsoever.
As a bonus the insulation makes it quieter outside when I'm working inside late at night. I'm sure my neighbors are glad I spent the money.

 

[mbryson]

I installed a mini-split this summer after insulating. It does a pretty nice job of keeping the shop warm- I keep it on it's lowest setting, which is 61F.
Bought the unit from PowerSaveAC.com for $589 with free shipping! Very easy DIY install. I was chillin' at 71F when it was 105F outside this summer.

I'm planning to build a small oil burner stove to augment the mini-split and help me get rid of some waste oil I've accumulated.

Did you buy this unit?

12000 BTU Mini Split Air Conditioner Heat Pump Ductless 230V INNOVAIR 19 SEER

12000 BTU Mini Split Air Conditioner Heat Pump Ductless 230V INNOVAIR 19 SEER SIZE OF PRODUCT Tons: 12,000 BTU/H Type: 19 SEER / 9.5 HSPF Heat Pump Voltage: 208/230V SYSTEM INCLUDES (1) 9,000 BTU + (1) 24,000 BTU Indoor Uni

powersaveac.com

I assume this unit gets mounted outside the house?

 

[Greg]

I was wondering how the mini-split was working for heating, as we're headed into Winter. I still want one in my shop! This Summer I added a portable A/C unit in the shop and it made a nice difference when it was 100*'s outside.

I recently added 2, 110V oil-filled radiant heaters in my shop. They're cheap units that Walmart had... $60/ea IIRC?

The shop is pretty good sized, but with both of them running on high, it's been very comfortable in my shop... like t-shirt comfortable. Of course, my walls are finished and it's a well insulated building. Obviously electricity costs are going to jump up, but as a temporary solution that I can use as needed, it's handy.

 

[mbryson]

I was wondering how the mini-split was working for heating, as we're headed into Winter. I still want one in my shop! This Summer I added a portable A/C unit in the shop and it made a nice difference when it was 100*'s outside.

I recently added 2, 110V oil-filled radiant heaters in my shop. They're cheap units that Walmart had... $60/ea IIRC?

The shop is pretty good sized, but with both of them running on high, it's been very comfortable in my shop... like t-shirt comfortable. Of course, my walls are finished and it's a well insulated building. Obviously electricity costs are going to jump up, but as a temporary solution that I can use as needed, it's handy.

My insulated garage is really not bad at all so far. It hasn't been cold here yet either.

 

[OCNORB]

Did you buy this unit?

12000 BTU Mini Split Air Conditioner Heat Pump Ductless 230V INNOVAIR 19 SEER

12000 BTU Mini Split Air Conditioner Heat Pump Ductless 230V INNOVAIR 19 SEER SIZE OF PRODUCT Tons: 12,000 BTU/H Type: 19 SEER / 9.5 HSPF Heat Pump Voltage: 208/230V SYSTEM INCLUDES (1) 9,000 BTU + (1) 24,000 BTU Indoor Uni

powersaveac.com

I assume this unit gets mounted outside the house?
View attachment 143460

Yes.

That is the one. It works well, but uses more power than I’d like to heat.

I actually bought one of those diesel heaters that are used in RVs and trucks. The exhaust goes through the wall of my shop. It does a pretty nice job of taking the chill off and it sips the fuel on the lowest setting, which is usually enough to keep my well insulated shop 50-55F; which i think is about perfect for me. I can crank it up and get the shop to 70, but it drinks a lot more fuel.

It’s not smelly, not particularly noisy and I just hook it to an old 12v battery and a small charger. So far is the best shop “warmer” I’ve tried. Need to see if i can find a place that sells red dye diesel now and it could be even cheaper to run.

The a/c part of that mini-split is definitely worth the trouble. When it’s above 35 it doesn’t use much to heat, but when it gets below that it kicks in resistive heating that is just too expensive for my tight-wad ways.

 

[1969honda]

Last winter I finished up my 20' radiant tube heater and then promptly left the country about a month and a half later in February. In that month and a half though I pulled the engine completely out of my little Golf TDI commuter and did a bunch of work on it. The only wall in my garage that is insulated is between it and the house, the ceiling is also bare above the sheet rock to the trusses. I was able I get a killer rebate on a Nest thermostat that put me any $5 or of pocket for it. Between the Nest and the radiant tube heater I think my gas bill only went up a few dollars for that month or so that I was in there daily and had the heat set to 55° at night and 65° during the day. I love that it beats the actual objects in the shop and turns them into heat sinks vs heating the air.

Currently I have it set to go down to 40-45° at night and up to around 65° during the day on weekends when I'm home and working in there. Best part is with the Nest I can bump up the heat from my phone on my way home from work if I'm going to be working in the garage and within 20-30 minutes is up to temp. It also stays fairly warm when I leave the door open while blowing snow the first few feet away from the door and gets back to full temp within a very short time of closing.

If you have a large open shop for the ~$1.5-2k I spent on the heater, running a gas line and venting materials it was totally worth it. It's also kosher to spray finishes and paint without fire hazard worry. Mine pulls intake air from the attic via a 4" ABS pipe thru the ceiling that routes to the top of my roof so I can insulate the ceiling later, then vent out the side wall at my eves.

It can get a little toasty if directly under it with my 9' ceiling but if yours is higher it would be even better. Only concern is parking to closely underneath it; it technically could bake the wife's Escalade's finish where I'm at minimum stand of if pulled in really close to my work bench, but that's a very rare occasion.

 

[frieed]

The two car side of my garage (my shop) is insulated on 2 sides, has an uninsulated partition wall separating it from the the third bay, and an uninsulated front wall. I did hack up about about R6 in the single wall garage door and blew R24's worth of cellulose above the ceiling.
In the partition wall I installed an 18k BTU window unit A/C which has about 4k BTU of heat. When running A/C I crack the garage door on the single bay side of wall and turn on the 24" exhaust fan to exhaust the heat from the AC. 18k cooling is way overkill for a 2 car garage, but it helps cool it faster. As for heat, with my mish-mash of insulation I can keep it comfortable when frigid outside. I don't spend a ton of time in the shop so I don't worry about the cost of the electricity. If I were to do it again, I'd fully insulate and put in a ductless split for AC and a gas fired heater.
I've seen posts on other forums where someone got a used furnace from an HVAC repair guy and stuck it in the corner (or hang from ceiling if a horizontal unit). They put in a proper exhaust vent and just blew the heated air straight out into the shop with no ducting.

 

[Herzog]

Bumping this thread. With the new shop build I'm considering different heating options. I think I might end up with a wood stove in there in a couple years from now but until then I'm looking at some other options.

We have a 1,000 gallon propane tank for our home but considering it's location I'd rather not tap into it, especially since it's nicely buried as well. I'd probably be ok with putting another propane tank above ground just for the shop since we have them come out to top off the big tank once a year.

Then again, maybe just stick with electric heat since price/kw is a lot lower in WY than I'm used to.

So many choices...

I like the idea of electric because I can just set the thermostat and keep the shop above freezing when I'm not out there for days at a time, but the efficiency of the infrared propane heaters just seem so much better.

The electric for maintaining heat and wood stove for working heat might be the ticket?

 

[jeeper]

I hated the wood stove in my shop. Took too long to get up to heat, and made everything stink.
Also had to keep an eye on it to keep it going.

 

[1969honda]

Radiant will use all the physical items in the shop as heart sink vs heating the air? I'm planning on a radiant tube again in my new shop I'm working to get building permits for. The other benefit with radiant is they are a sealed burned so anytime you spray a paint or finish the risk of a fire is very reduced.

 

[Unimog]

IMO, Def go with propane and radiant if your ceilings are high enough.