Higher Education

[UNSTUCK]

As a background I have an OS "degree" from a technical school in Diesel and Industrial Technology. This is pretty much a worthless degree as far as transferring it into a more worthwhile degree. That education was also a bit of a waste as I already knew most of the course material, but I did land my first job right from the school, which got me a great "real world" education.
Fast forward 15 years, now I sit at a desk as the "maintenance manager" of a large company here in Salt Lake. It's mostly a glorified title as I manage myself only in the repair of manufacturing equipment and upkeep of the building. I have no employees that I oversee. I do manage most of the vendors we use for various jobs around the facility.
I set a goal a long time ago to be done turning wrenches when I turn 40. I'm 38 now. I have this fear of being a 60 year old beat up mechanic. I'd like to take my knowledge and experience and lead a team of mechanics, or maybe lead different teams or individuals as a facilities manager. I feel like I have a pretty good resume with relevant knowledge and experience, but I feel like I need to have more in the education department. I haven't really attempted going after a new job so I dont know what a hiring manager would think of my resume or if they would think I have the skills to lead a team. I think I make VERY good money for what I do, but I also worked over 600 hours of overtime last year. I have no problem working 10-12 hours a day.

So I'm looking at more education. I see there are 2,4, and 6 year degrees in different types of business management. I also see that I could take some courses and get certificates of completion. At this point I don't see me doing 4 or 6 years of school. 2 years could make sense or even these certificate programs. I'm not looking to run a business, so I don't know that would affect the decision. Maybe more education on just people management.

So what are your thoughts? What schooling have you done and was it worth it? Is there a good online program you would recommend?

 

[Herzog]

My only recommendation: Be a leader, not a manager. The rest usually falls in place if you are good at what you do.

 

[moab_cj5]

Education depends on what your ultimate goal is. Yes, that piece of paper can impress some hiring managers, and yes, it can be a barrier to entry into some companies and opportunities. I would identify a job you would like, and a company you would like to work for, then talk to their HR department (if they are big enough to have one) and find out what they look for when hiring.

Also, network with people in the industry you want to be in. There are ways to make your work history and experience help you, but furthering your education is never a bad thing either.

 

[UNSTUCK]

I ran across this web site that is pretty interesting.

https://www.fm.training/

They train and give out credentials that could be very beneficial. Looking at the course material it has everything I was interested in. The cost would be about $2k. I would then test locally to receive the certified facilities manager, CFM title. I have no idea, but I would think that having that title would be worth more than the cost to get it.

 

[Deleted member 12904]

 

[Greg]

Any chance of promotion above your current position with the same company? In my line of work, that's how it seems to go for many... after many years, you end up with all kinds of experience and knowledge... advancement into management is always an option. The thing is, at least with my job, you pretty much sell your soul to the devil.... the company owns you. Working all the time, managing way too much for one guy, etc. And the pay isn't much better than a decently paid hourly employee.

 

[UNSTUCK]

Funny you bring that up. My boss and his boss have talked to me a few times about me taking my bosses position when he retires "in 2 years". He's been saying that for the last 5 years. In the last month there has been a new guy kind of following my boss around. Rumor has it now that he is going to take my boss's place. Noone has said anything to me though. I need to talk to them to see what's going on. I wouldn't mind that position as it would open lots of doors through the years.

 

[Kiel]

Best thing I ever did was stop being a manager and just get a better job as an employee. Same or better money for less hours. Better benefits Shit, we have corporate ping pong and frisbee golf. I did need an associates degree to get my foot in the door

 

[Caleb]

I've been in a role that I do the hiring for my groups for a long time. My opinion is in most fields education doesn't mean as much as some people want it to mean. My best people are the ones that have real world on the job experience. I'd take 4 years of on the job experience over 4 years of schooling. So point being, don't expect to all of sudden have tons of opportunities just by completing a couple simple courses and taking a test. If it's easy to get, it's worth even less. When I interview people, I rarely even look at their education because I have ways and I want them to prove what they know. If they can't confidently answer my simple questions, or figure out our mundane hands-on exercises (we even let them use google or whatever to look up the answers) then there's no way they'll cut it in our group.

As for promotions within your company, you need to let them know you're interested in progression. If you just sit back and expect it to come to you, rarely will that work and then you become bitter when someone else is promoted over you even though you feel like you deserved it more. Some fields, the only way to get more money or better positions is to leave the company. My field is generally that way, but in the last couple years, myself and my VP have been working really hard to make sure our people have career paths and are paid above market wages. I never want someone to leave for more money or for a promotion that I could have provided. If they leave for personal reasons (new place is closer to their house, they offer a benefit I don't have any say over, etc) then there isn't a whole lot I can do about that. I try to make sure that the other benefits and work environment is so much better that sometimes those other benefits come in below in priority and a little longer commute is worth it to them.

When I was welding/wrenching many years ago, even though in total I only did it for a short time, I worked with a couple guys that were old bitter guys that had been doing the same things I was forever. I feared being that same way, so I understand what you're feeling.

 

[UNSTUCK]

Good insite Caleb. I really don't see myself going after a college degree, but I don't mind spending some money to further educate myself. I think it's impossible to adjust your resume to catch the eye of each new potential employer because you don't know what they're looking for, so it makes sense to have one that is very well rounded. One that shows lots of practical experience along with education. I think I have the perfect resume for someone looking for a wrench turner, but lacking when trying to go beyond that.

 

[Greg]

Funny you bring that up. My boss and his boss have talked to me a few times about me taking my bosses position when he retires "in 2 years". He's been saying that for the last 5 years. In the last month there has been a new guy kind of following my boss around. Rumor has it now that he is going to take my boss's place. Noone has said anything to me though. I need to talk to them to see what's going on. I wouldn't mind that position as it would open lots of doors through the years.

I think you need to set up a meeting with them both, have a sit down and explain that you aren't happy with your career and the future that you can see, where you are.

If you're brave, you could always look for other jobs in other related management fields, perhaps put out a few resumes. Then let them know that you're looking for advancement, more responsibility, better pay, whatever you are seeking with other companies. See if you can motivate them to keep you, (assuming that they see your knowledge and experience ARE worth keeping around) but open up doors that wouldn't otherwise be opening. They may see you as a great fit for the job you're in now, but not see you as someone to take over the bosses job when he retires.

 

[Caleb]

I think I have the perfect resume for someone looking for a wrench turner, but lacking when trying to go beyond that.

I think you're selling yourself short. The best leaders aren't those that have a Business Management degree, but rather those that have and are working "in the trenches". They know the issues first hand and know how to deal the daily challenges. I'm never afraid to ask my guys to do a late night maintenance, or fix something the right way because I have done it myself and know what it takes. I try my best to stay connected to the issues all my guys face, but I find the further up the management chain I go, the more disconnected I get. I have to rely on my leaders to keep me informed of the issues and challenges that are happening. So get that mindset out of your head that you aren't qualified, you are, you just need to believe that. (and I think you really do believe that, otherwise we wouldn't be having this discussion )

 

[Deleted member 12904]

I think I have the perfect resume for someone looking for a wrench turner, but lacking when trying to go beyond that.

I recently made a career change similar to what you're looking to do. Every single job I interviewed for said a bachelors or master was required. I got several job offers and honestly not once was my lack of continuing education even brought up. I don't have the answers but I can tell you what I did.

1- Get a professional resume done with head shot. Pay for these services if needed. (Head shots test better vs no picture)
2- Network. All the vendors you work with. Well they service lots of other facilities. talk to them and ask them to keep an ear open for you.
3- Linked in.. Build that network. its not facebook its not just to friend your friends. Use it to contact the decisions makes at the places you want to work. Get your resume directly to them and bypass HR.
4- Follow through. Ask if its okay to check in once a week. they will say no if they are not interested but if they say yes put a reminder in your phone and follow through with a quick call or email letting them know you are still interested and will check back in another week if that is okay.
5- Be patient. Higher paying jobs have a long hiring cycle. Its easy to get frustrated but the facts are the people doing the hiring and decision making have a job to do also. It takes time.

 

[BlueWolfFab]

Ya gotta do what works best for you. Personally I have no plans for further education and I believe that will work for my life plans. I'm blue-collar through and through and will probably work similar to the fields of work that I'm in now until I'm an old man, and I'm completely fine with that. Further education isn't a cost vs. reward situation that seems to fit me.

My further education will seemingly come from just in-field work experience and I'm good with that.

 

[Noahfecks]

4- Follow through. Ask if its okay to check in once a week. they will say no if they are not interested but if they say yes put a reminder in your phone and follow through with a quick call or email letting them know you are still interested and will check back in another week if that is okay.

This is a big one, when i have been in the position to hire i never hired anyone that didn't call me to follow up on their application or interview and many hiring managers have told me i stood out because of follow up when i was looking

One thing to keep in mind is that sometimes your opportunity to move up with another company may involve a lateral move to a new company with the prospect of advancement later

 

[Caleb]

Personally, I get annoyed when candidates follow-up too often. I do aim to give them a decision in a short period of time (2 weeks or less). That could either be we would like to bring you in for an onsite, we want to make you an offer, or we're not interested depending on where they are in the process. If I tell a candidate I will get back with them by a certain date, I'll give them one freebie if they follow-up before that, any more and it rules them out...I don't need someone that's needy or that can't listen to and understand what I tell them.

I guess the point is, get an understanding of what they want or what's ok with them. You can ask for dates or at least timeframes, and ask if you don't hear from them within that timeframe or by that date if it's ok if you follow-up with them.

Another piece of advice, and I don't know if this applies in your line of work, but don't be afraid to use a recruiter/head hunter. They often have a direct line to the hiring managers and can talk to them about you as a person and why you're a great fit for that position. You pay nothing for this and it's in their best interest to get you the most money as their fee they get is usually based on your salary.

 

[ID Bronco]

1- Get a professional resume done with head shot. Pay for these services if needed. (Head shots test better vs no picture)

What service/who did you use?

Another piece of advice, and I don't know if this applies in your line of work, but don't be afraid to use a recruiter/head hunter. They often have a direct line to the hiring managers and can talk to them about you as a person and why you're a great fit for that position. You pay nothing for this and it's in their best interest to get you the most money as their fee they get is usually based on your salary.

Do you have any you recommend?

 

[Caleb]

Do you have any you recommend?

I can only speak to Tech Recruiters, if that's what you're interested in, I really like working with Tony Ventrano at KForce. I can 100% trust the referrals he sends to me and he won't refer you some where that you won't be a fit (culturally, etc).