IFS vs. SAS

i wanted to go IFS on my truck but it is alot of Cash to spend, it will be cheaper to just beef up your IFS. I got a 6 inch lift and i can do every trail in AF and 5 mile no problem, sure i hit the drop bracket once in a while, but i clear everything else with no problem, plus, drop bracket makes your CV's straight for less stress, i still need alot of work on my suspension.

P.S hey a trail is fun when you actually have to think how your going to get up an obstacle, if your going to put solid axle and make it un destructible it will be no fun hitting the local trails, youll have to start traveling to find harder trails. "/
 
TROKITA said:
i wanted to go IFS on my truck but it is alot of Cash to spend, it will be cheaper to just beef up your IFS. I got a 6 inch lift and i can do every trail in AF and 5 mile no problem, sure i hit the drop bracket once in a while, but i clear everything else with no problem, plus, drop bracket makes your CV's straight for less stress, i still need alot of work on my suspension.
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or just get a 2" OME lift and a diff drop kit. :D
 
If anything, you can go long travel IFS if you are worried about front travel. You will get more from your ifs, plus have a little more height under ya. I don't see much of a point to do SAS under a rig that is going to be a weekend warrior and see more pavement then dirt and rocks, plus if your aren't crawling it much why go SAS where it comes in more handy. Just my &.02
 
UFAB said:
Toyota IFS will work fine, hard to swap in a Solid axle and have low CG. Getting good up travel for the diff to clear and shocks to cycle is hard for an everyday driver at a reasonable height.
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I disagree. 4" of total lift
3rdGen_boltOn_019.jpg


FWIW, I am back into an IFS 3rd gen 4runner again. But, I don't plan on doing anything like I did in the one above. In fact, its going to be my son's rig in about six months to DD.

One thing I will say. I always ask guys if they ever regret going to a solid axle. Not one person in 6+ yrs of being in business has ever said that they regretted it.

I will say that the new style IFS is better than the old torsion bar design. I just always get tired of needing alignments on a regular basis.
 
If you look around and take your time to get parts, you can do an SAS for pretty cheap. I SAS'd my '86 for around $1000. I found a great deal on a built front axle w/ highsteer, bought a donor truck for $100 that had a front crossmember, lift springs, and shackles, found a steering box for $50, flat p arm for $50, and a couple hundred bucks in misc TG parts and I was there, and it rode AWESOME, even on graded roads like PET. I liked the crossmember because it wasn't so high-profile like the TG ones you buy, and I frenched it a little. I was running 35's w/ around 3" of lift and I only pounded flat the pinch welds on the fender. I built it all to move the front axle forward about 4" from stock and it came out great! I didn't even need to cut out the front body mount for the steering box. I think I got reeeeally lucky because it all just fit and worked perfectly when I was done. If you research and do it right, it can be cheap(ish) and work well. There may be a few other variables for the 3rd gen rigs but you get my point. I like the simpleness and durability of an SAS, but if you're only REALLY wheeling a few times a year and camping/exploring/expeditioneering the rest, look into Steve's front end set-up, and don't do bigger than 33's. A good set of 33's will take you everywhere that an ok set of 35's will, and you'll go through hell and back to get the 35's to fit ok w/ IFS by yourself. (just ask Steve)
 
I am always of the opinion that a rear locker will always be of more benefit than a SFA. If both of you rear wheels are off the ground at the same time, you may need a tow truck rather than a SFA. Also remember that the one wheel salute is a badge of honor.
 
I already have a lot of the parts I need to do the SAS but like I said I am now thinking it's not needed. I'm at the height I like, I do WANT to go with a 35" tire, key word WANT not NEED. I would need to up grade the front shock and would probably go with a coil over. I already have the diff drop. Really I think its a matter of cutting the fenders and tubbing it and mounting the 35's my bro gave me and it would be where I would be happy with it FOR NOW!!! I could probably sell the stuff I have for the SAS and have enough for gears. Or keep it for when I decide IFS is not enough.

I do appreciate all the comments and I think I've made my decision to stay IFS til I need SAS.

Steve I will for sure need help tubbing if you are available. It won't be until later this winter but if your willing let me know a day that will work for you. I can be pretty flexible and my dad has a nice heated shop with a lift. Even if you could help with one side and give me an idea of what to do on the other.
 
what front axle do you have for the sas?

I've had coilovers before (2.5" icons), and I like the OME setup much more. Plus it's cheaper. :)
 
I have a waggy D44 (NOT BUILT). I have a feeling like has been mentioned before that if I do the SAS it won't be enough. next I'm going to want a inchworm lefty and thats where it gets PRICEY!
 
sixstringsteve said:
I've had coilovers before (2.5" icons), and I like the OME setup much more. Plus it's cheaper. :)
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I'm not appossed to save a little cash!!

I am extremly happy with how the rear turned out with the LC coils, but I know the top plates are not ideal. I will have to change my Tie rods when I tried to have it aligned this summer they were frozen and place couldnt align it. the actually broke one side. So I guess I would only have to change one side..
 
If I were in you position and I wanted an SFA, I would high consider selling out on the 4runner and getting a locked FJ80. Your 4runner is a very sharp looking rig and it would fetch a premium. I think an fj80 would satisfy your rock crawling needs but keep you in the Yota family. Something to consider.
 
This brings back memories of manual vs auto back in the early days. Different strokes for different folks. Do what fits your needs and own it.
 
one thing i saw mentioned a few times was what trails you will be doing..

one thing i never saw mentioned is what do you wanta do on those trails..

are you the kinda guy that has to make the toughest climb on the trail?

or are you okay with going around alot of the hard stuff / pulling winch?


i like the fj80 idea.. you could find one with e lockers front and rear. they have strong birfs blah blah( and thats my dream vehicle)

SAS can be done $$$$$ or cheap.. and can be done good either way.. some people pay alot for extra stuff just to say they " did it the right way"

others cut corners to say they did it cheap...

can be done cheap and right.. use RUF to keep it low and save some money on springs, keep low cog, but like mentioned above its hard to keep it low and not have up travel issues..blah blah good luck and keep us posted with what you decide
 
zukijames said:
one thing i saw mentioned a few times was what trails you will be doing..

one thing i never saw mentioned is what do you wanta do on those trails..

are you the kinda guy that has to make the toughest climb on the trail?

or are you okay with going around alot of the hard stuff / pulling winch?


i like the fj80 idea.. you could find one with e lockers front and rear. they have strong birfs blah blah( and thats my dream vehicle)

SAS can be done $$$$$ or cheap.. and can be done good either way.. some people pay alot for extra stuff just to say they " did it the right way"

others cut corners to say they did it cheap...

can be done cheap and right.. use RUF to keep it low and save some money on springs, keep low cog, but like mentioned above its hard to keep it low and not have up travel issues..blah blah good luck and keep us posted with what you decide
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That is a good question! I guess as for right now I'm the kind of guy that likes to try the hard stuff but knows my limits. If I don't think I can make an obstical I may try it but am not afraid to be beaten and will bypass if needed.

As for the FJ80 I really don't think that is an option right now. I love my Runner and it has the potential to be pretty BAD A$$ I just need to be patiant and not get ahead of myself.

I think for now I am going to hold off on the SAS. I will hold on to the the parts I have and as I develop myself as a wheeler, my balls get a little bigger, and I start trying things that will break stuff then I will venture down the SAS path. For now I just need a sawsall, a welder, and a big hammer to make everything fit and not rub. ;)
;)
 
I made a step by step thread on ttora. I'll have to go find it. You're going to have to cut A LOT MORE than you think. I had to trim the front half of my body mount.off.
 
take your time and do it as clean as you can.. i
ve seen alot of guys hack up a street driven rig and then enjoyed it less because it didnt look very good ... im trying to decide if i'm going to stack trimming on my land rover
 
I think you are wise to ask these kinds of questions.
browsed thru this thread pretty quick so i hope i'm not going over something that someone else said, but here is what comes to my mind. Alignment has been one of the biggest drawbacks to the IFS rigs i've owned. And tires these days are ungodly expensive. When you get to the point where your alignment won't stay in, tie rods wear out too fast, etc AND you love your rig and want to keep it, then you know SAS is right for you.
The other thing is if $ is something that you have too much of and you know you will get a lot of value out of seeing your rig and being seen with a straight axle, then go for it now. Endeavor to do it right the first time and keep it low. I've done several axle swaps and i'm still no expert...each time asking the pros for advice. You are lucky to have a Yota with a huge aftermarket following and a lot of people have been there done that already. But don't settle for less than what you really want, or yes the SAS will 'never be done'. for example:
I went with coil over and my Nissan Frontier rides super nice. Not like it did when it was IFS but not leaf spring SAS either.
I don't think you need SAS for the trails you run (right now). I saw a supersweet Yota with a doubler that was snow wheeling up in the Foothills one time. It was IFS but it had excellent control and a diversity of gears which made it go great in the deep snow.
On the other hand i'd stay off of super hard trails like Pritchett. Of the 6 or so IFS yotas iv'e seen on it, 4 were broken but i guy admitted he turned around to shepherd his 2 pals back out and i have little doubt he would have made it. I guess i'm just sayin' that SAS gets a lot less expensive when you confront expensive IFS failure over and over, from parts to alignment. This is just my personal anecdotal experience. I am not a 4x4 shop, never said i was, and i don't care for ARBs but i still have them. :)
 
Fwiw, my alignment is perfect (thanks to my specialty products upper control arms). So it is possible to have perfect alignment with ifs.
 
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