More than just a CCW Class

[UNSTUCK]

Well I had an experience last Sunday (in church, of all places) that has left gun ownership on my mind quite a bit lately. I told my wife about it, who is Pro-gun, but 100000000000000000% anti-gun in our house. After telling her about it, she confessed that she also has been having feelings about the need for getting one (or two).

Together we know next to nothing about them. I'd say my only knowledge comes from watching Die Hard and Rambo movies, back in the day.

My thought is that before I buy a firearm I want to be certified to conceal carry, but not only that I want to be qualified to use it. From my limited understanding, the concealed classes do not teach proper handling and use, just law. I don't believe that myself nor my wife could become qualified just by going out to the desert and shooting up a refrigerator like so many others think is okay.

So my question is, is there a class that will do both? If not, is there classes that will do both? I'd like real life tactical training that will help me avoid puking the moment I find myself in a real situation. One that could help me keep my wits about me. What's out there to help me with all this? Do I need to take up paintballing as well? Is that even still popular?

What have you guys done with guns and your children? My thought would be to teach them everything I learn about them. Let them hold them, look at them, ect. Try to take all the curiousness or mystery away from them. Or is it better to do just the opposite and make them think we dont have them? My kids are ages 4-11.

Thanks for any input and wish us luck on this new journey.


PS: I'm sure all this sounds pretty dumb to most of you...

 

[ricsrx]

I don't believe that myself nor my wife could become qualified just by going out to the desert and shooting up a refrigerator like so many others think is okay.

..

that is how I learned, after 1000's of rounds you get fairly good at handling a firearm.

 

[TRD270]

Most classes just teach you basic fundamentals, you can get more advanced tactical classes but they are quite spendy. If you have a friend or family member that is familiar (really familiar not just thinks they are) I think they are your best resource for learning. Unless you get one on one instruction in a class you're better off with a friend or family member. The classes I have observed there is usually one really bad, unsafe, etc etc student who will consume 90% of the instructors time leaving you with wasted money and little knowledge gained.

However if you do take a generic class for basic learning the best thing you can do is practice, but you also don't want to develop bad muscle memory or habits as they are hard to unlearn. Don't try to be Clint Eastwood right off the bat, take your time between shots, ensure you have proper grip and sight picture before pulling the trigger. It will eventually come natural and you can speed up your shots

Also remember treat all firearms as if they are loaded even if you know they aren't

 

[dutchman]

I took a tactical/defensive pistol course that definitely made me feel more comfortable carrying concealed. The course consisted of about 2 hours in the classroom discussing your response to different situations, cover vs. concealment, how to move and think while in a active shooter or other scenarios. The classroom session was followed by about 2 hours on the range shooting from different positions, shoot/reload/shoot, drawing from your holster. Lastly was some "force-on-force" using simunition rounds.

As far as guns with kids, my wife and I made an effort educate our 5 yr old (as much as can be done) on what guns are and what they're not. She knows not to touch a gun and to grab an adult if she finds one. This may be a bit controversial, but we're planning on getting her a .22 rifle soon so she can begin to appreciate, respect, and enjoy firearms.

Your situation/results may vary, but this has worked for us.

 

[Kevin B.]

Paintball/airsoft might give you some rudimentary tactical awareness, but I don't think it would be the kind of awareness that would be useful in your context. I agree that situational classes are a good idea, I can't recommend any though. You also need a lot of range time, even if it's shooting up appliances in the desert (I've cleaned up the appliances I've murdered, for the record).

As far as kids go, I've got a ten year old and a two year old. The older boy has a .22 and .410 of his own, and he shoots them. He knows gun safety rules and he's well drilled in what to do if he's at a friends house and guns come out, or even if one of his friends somehow gets ahold of one of ours at our house. The younger boy will get the same treatment when he gets around five or six y/o. I think it's important that your kids be versed in firearms safety, both to take the mystery away and to give them a path to follow if things with a friend get unsafe. I think that's important even if you don't have guns in the house, and absolutely mandatory if you do. Hiding the guns only leads to them discovering and exploring on their own instead of under your supervision, you know?

 

[lime chev]

Wow, ironically my family had an experience at church as well that spurred me to get educated. Same boat here, been thinking about hunters ed for me and my boy(12) and starting off small like a 22 rifle . A 22 will be cheaper to shoot as we learn to handle and care for a firearm. Then a shotgun and so on. I have noticed at least one club/range/store does offer classes but I have yet to check further into it. As for kids mine are older. My girl(9) doesn't like loud noises already but we will still educate her and what not. My boy honestly is a good kid that I KNOW wouldn't mess around while I'm not around but that is why Ill keep the gun locked up with the Bolt hidden elsewhere and ammo locked separately. Interested if I'm on the right path.

 

[rholbrook]

I grew up around guns. I spent time hunting and shooting. My boys and my daughter are educated in the safe use of guns. My daughter actually smoked all the boys and men the night they shot for their hunters safety. It became a thing that night to see if anyone could out shoot her. That being said, they didnt get there by being afraid of guns and that guns are evil. I have told all my kids that if they are anywhere that one of their friends brings a gun out to show it off that he or she is to get out of there, get their friends out of there and call me or another adult pronto. Guns are not to played with period but you need to educate your children.

You can start by asking someone here to take you and your family shooting. There are lots of us on here that would take you. There are gun ranges that have classes, you have Hunters Safety, you have CCW classes. My nephew in law teaches a gun class just for women in the Layton area. There are lots of classes out there but you need to get experience by shooting.

 

[UNSTUCK]

Ill keep the gun locked up with the Bolt hidden elsewhere and ammo locked separately. Interested if I'm on the right path.

This seems very safe as far as kids go, but I wonder about the response time that would be involved if an intruder were to come into your house?

 

[UNSTUCK]

You can start by asking someone here to take you and your family shooting. There are lots of us on here that would take you. There are gun ranges that have classes, you have Hunters Safety, you have CCW classes. My nephew in law teaches a gun class just for women in the Layton area. There are lots of classes out there but you need to get experience by shooting.

While there are a few guys on here I trust, I have no idea of their gun knowledge, or if they even have guns as well. That's why I'm so interested in a shooting class where I can learn the basics and once that's done, I can go find the fridge Kevin left behind and shoot it up some more.

 

[ID Bronco]

Classes are great for beginners. I would take hunter's safety in addition to a shooting class. Just go to a gun shop with a range and they can hook you up. I find that starting out with my kids, using a small caliber at first builds a lot of confidence. I too teach my kids about guns and lock them up at our house. I am much more worried about them getting into one at a friends house than at mine. I start my kids with bb guns at about 5-6 and .22's at 8. Practice breeds confidence.

 

[boogie_4wheel]

My upbringing had me in Hunter Safety at a young age, teaching the things like "What is behind your target", safe shooting paths, gun handling and safety, shooting positions, ect. Great course for young and old to acquire general firearm knowledge.

11 years ago, my CWP class was absolute garbage. Partially because of the teacher, partially because of the requirements of the state. Many of the gun shops along the front offer an assortment of classes from entry-level to more advanced, and this could be money well spent as well. I'm tempted to take an intermediate class with my wife to further hone her skills. She is an excellent shot in calm conditions, but all of us could use more practice.

I have done some friendly 'competition' IDPA-style shooting where a group of us got together once a month, set up a pistol range, created a scenario, then do time and accuracy. Different shooting positions (standing, walking, leaning, hiding behind something, shoot with non-dominant). Sometimes we would load each others mags with a dummy round to simulate a misfire; you wouldn't know when it would happen, but would need to quickly recover from it.

Practice practice practice. There is absolutely nothing wrong with going out in the desert and emptying a couple boxes at a few left over beer cans and paper plates. I wish Utah would require a re certification for CWP that included proving your ability to hit a target. I'm afraid for the amount of permit and non permit holders out there that are carrying right now and would have hard time hitting the ground within 20' of them. So, practice! Be able to hit your target, because as Hunter Safety teaches you, what is behind your target if you miss? You are responsible for that bullet.

I'm debating heading out this weekend with my 5yr with a 22lr and letting her shoot at balloons stapled to a 2x4 (large target with an obvious response to hitting the target vs a paper).

 

[Unimog]

For you and the kids, learn gun safety and then practice handling guns safely - whether you do this in a professional class or go out with someone who is maybe a little anal about safe handling. I believe until kids actually handle different kinds of firearms and get to see/experience incorrect and correct handling first hand, and experience the power of a firearm, they don't really have the respect they need to.

Your first time out, make sure there is an adequate ratio (best is 1:1) of experienced gun handlers to those actually handling a firearm for the first time. I work with some folks from India who we have taken shooting. We make sure that every shooter has a "handler" that is always there to catch a muzzle moving in the wrong direction or correct seemingly small issues. Anyone who has taken a FrontSight or similar course will know what I'm talking about.

It may be my attitude, but I actually think paintball and airsoft handling can teach a casualness about gun handling that should never happen with the real thing. I'm not against paintball or airlift, just don't think they help in most contexts that I have seen. Just my two cents.

 

[Unimog]

Oh yea, I'm not crazy about separating bolts and such, but a trigger lock doesn't replace a safe. IMO, you really should have a safe or secure locking cabinet to keep firearms at home.

 

[TRD270]

I wish Utah would require a re certification for CWP that included proving your ability to hit a target. I'm afraid for the amount of permit and non permit holders out there that are carrying right now and would have hard time hitting the ground within 20' of them.

This, in my CWP class years ago when we were doing the "familiarization" fire, a woman two stalls down from me was shooting with her eyes closed, no surprise she had zero rounds on target. I wish some sort of qualification was required even if it was just the first time.

 

[jeeper]

We have memberships to front sight in Vegas. They are a shooting training facility. Fairly expensive though. I imagine there is something local and closer.

We have gone the route of allowing kids all the access they want to the guns in hopes that it takes away the desire to sneak peeks. At anytime they are allowed to ask me to see and play with any of the firearms. I keep them (well, most of them) behind locked door and in a locked safe.
It seems to be working so far, and hopefully continues to do so. The kids occasionally ask to see them, and sometimes even ask for more 'gun safety training', so I teach them the basic rules again. And again. And again.

 

[lime chev]

Originally Posted by lime chev Ill keep the gun locked up with the Bolt hidden elsewhere and ammo locked separately. Interested if I'm on the right path.
This seems very safe as far as kids go, but I wonder about the response time that would be involved if an intruder were to come into your house?




I have a bat. Small town of 12000. Most know of me and my lime green truck I've had for 18 years. Doesn't hurt I'm 6'4" 240. I know I'm not immune though and have other tricks up my sleeve.

 

[UNSTUCK]

Is there a gun size that would be recommended that both my wife and I can learn on or do we really need different guns?

 

[jeeper]

Is there a gun size that would be recommended that both my wife and I can learn on or do we really need different guns?

The only answer to this is go to a store and handle nearly every gun.
My wife has VERY expensive fingers. I have very cheap fingers.
We cannot use the same guns, but you may be able too.

 

[gijohn40]

the major gun ranges in town all have classes that you can take.. they are not all that expensive and there are even classes for only women so they don't get the male hormones pushing them to do something they do not want to do. There is a new range opening soon in murray right next to the UHP office. There is a guy on FB named Dennis Lee that runs the counterterrorism Institute (a business to train people). http://www.combat-terror.com/

I was in a training brigade in the military where I spend months at the ranges teaching/correcting soldiers firing everything from handguns up to the M2 50 cal.
If you wanted to go to a range and do one on one I would be glad to take you or your wife or both.

 

[DAA]

For total beginners Hunter Safety with you two plus the older kid certainly isn't a bad place to start.

- DAA