Teach britney #1....Which rig?

[Vonski]

Originally posted by brian
back to the first question..........I think IMHO ALL-PRO has answered it with "tiny".........

Not sure if ya knew, AllPro didn't build it. The owners of this rig are Nelson and Nelson Racing, desert race guru's.

 

[britney]

Thankyou for the debate boys.

The question is....... What do you consider the best vehicle for rockcrawling, and why?

I don't care if your rig is better than his rig or if this "brand" is a waste of money compared to freakin' hotwheels! All I want to know is your opinion on awesome vehicles/rigs, not why so-and so's is crappy. If you think it's great that's all that matters!!!

The reason this thread is not ridiculous is that it is giving me great ideas for questions I would like answered in the future. If you think someone is wrong start your own thread explaining why whatever sucks, but please don't do it here.

The debate is good and can be very educational, but it is not necessary yet. This question doesn't require it. They are only opinions, not necessarily fact!!!

Thanks,
Holly aka britney

 

[Vonski]

Originally posted by britney
Thankyou for the debate boys.

The question is....... What do you consider the best vehicle for rockcrawling, and why?

I understand what you're asking, but even with the best diplomatic approach to this topic, you'll still get the "my rig is better than you rig" people. Some guys just can't help it.

However, I'll try to answer this in the best way I can. Unfortunately, my answer will not be brand specific, so that may not give you any real information you may be wanting to aquire.

My rig (not neccessarily anyone else's ) would be equipped with the following:

Chev. Vortec V6 or V8
TH350 transmission with manual valve body
Atlas II tcase
35 spline Dana 60's
39.5 Krawlers

 

[britney]

Originally posted by Vonski


I understand what you're asking, but even with the best diplomatic approach to this topic, you'll still get the "my rig is better than you rig" people. Some guys just can't help it.

I know, I'm just trying to avoid the confusion that may come if there is the mine and yours debate. That's why I tried to start simple.

Thanks Von, Your rig sounds great and one day I hope to really understand what you said.


You guys may not think I'm serious but it just so happens that I am taking notes, and one day I just might understand enough to try building my own. (don't get too excited Jeremy, it might be a while)

 

[Vonski]

Originally posted by britney

Thanks Von, Your rig sounds great and one day I hope to really understand what you said.

Now thats damn funny.

 

[britney]

Originally posted by Vonski

Now thats damn funny.

OK VONSKI......I am not that stupid dammit!!!!!!
I know what the big picture is, I just don't completely understand the specifics.

Chev.Vortec V6 or V8
TH350 transmission with manual valve body
Atlas II tcase
35 spline Dana 60's
39.5 Krawlers

The only thing listed that I wouldn't want a bit of exlpanation on is the too huge for me 39.5 krawlers.
That's it, I think you need a brit-slap!!

 

[brian]

Originally posted by Vonski


Not sure if ya knew, AllPro didn't build it. The owners of this rig are Nelson and Nelson Racing, desert race guru's.

........your right....but you get my point........

 

[britney]

Originally posted by brian
back to the first question..........I think IMHO ALL-PRO has answered it with "tiny".........

Yeah, like I know what that is, brian you should know better than leaving that in the air. Please explain why "tiny" is so great.

 

[spencurai]

Originally posted by harkinoff


whats rock solid about a "stockish" toyota?

reliability and durability. My rule fo thumb on "stockish vehicles" is look what they drive in the outback in australia and in africa.....toyotas, nissans, mitsubishis, suzukis, isuzus and land rovers.....these are the vehicles that they rely upon to transport themselves across the most unforgiving terrain day after day......

 

[lowe1974]

Originally posted by Jeremy
tell me which rigs you cannot do this exact same thing to? I dare you. and it is just as easy.

So it is just as easy to do this swap in a samuri? How about a unimog, or even any year toyota. It is not that you cann't put together what every you want to, it is also how well it works together.

Vonski, I agree with you that there is not one best rig. I tried to make that understood in my first comment. I even said "if some ask what kind of 4x4 to get I say a toyota because it will give you the least amopunt of head ackes."

My opinion was very byass, I know but like britney ask tell her why you like you rig, and I was being a little facious (sp). I like you idea of a rig. I would just rather have it in a Scramlber instead of a buggy or toyota, or fullsize truck. And just for the record My Scrambler can flex. It might not be like some buggy but when my 35 inch tires start to rub the inside of the fender well on a degree ramp there is not much more you can. I already have 4.5 inches of lift with spring and 1 inch body. I don't need any more. Just yet

 

[tv_larsen]

Like everyone has said, nothing is best, everyone wheels what they can afford and what fits their wheeling style.

I wheel a full-size Dodge Ramcharger (I'm a Dodge guy). Wheeling a full-size has it's drawbacks, size, weight, size, width, size and height. But it has it's advantages too. They can be dirt cheap, and I mean dirt cheap. They come with many of the drivetrain parts that most people in Jeeps or Toys eventually upgrade too (axles, V8, ect..). Plus, when I do upgrade, one ton parts are a direct bolt in. I also have all of the suspension, transfercase, gear, locker, axle, engine and tranny upgrades I could ever need available to me. Also, I have room to haul everything I want with me. Many full-size trucks can fit 33" tires with minor fender trimming. Bigger tires are just a mild lift (or more trimming) away, thats easy with leaf springs front and rear.

I've wheeled with Jeeps, Toys, Sammys, and other full-sizes. There are obstacles that the smaller rigs walk, and the full-sizes struggle. There is also obstacles that the smaller rigs really struggle on, and the full-sizes can walk them.

The full-size trucks, especially Dodges, don't have as much aftermarket support as Jeeps, or Toys, but part of the Dodge mentality is adapting and fabricating. And since when was "bolt-on" hardcore anyways?


In reality, when anyone gets real hardcore, it really doesn't matter much what you start with. By that time, you've swapped out so much for a better mix of parts, what you started with really doesn't exist anymore.




And a particular side bonus for me wheeling the RC... About 80% of the parts on my Ramcharger are interchangable with my tow rig (1975 W200) as they share an almost identical drivetrain. This is great if one of them breaks a long way from home.

 

[troutbum]

I am a little late on this thread, but here is my $0.02.
TJ's work REAL well with very few modifications, Mini trucks (toyotas) are light, cheap to build and lots of parts. Sammi's are real light and can be built up for dirt cheap.

Scout's are heavy, slow, heavy and ugly (not as ugly as scramblers, but close). But I have always cheared for the underdog And since my plan was to build it all up from scratch a scout seemed like a good option.

You can routinely pick up scouts for 500.00, D44's, heavy ass v8, Good tcase (d20 or d300). There are maybe 6 bolt on parts available for the scout, so you learn how to fab stuff real quick. Bottom line, I like driving something different. Sure a stock TJ can prolly go a lot of the same places I can, but it is still a TJ...

 

[EZRhino]

Too bad I didn't catch this thread earlier on when some bunch of dammed rice burning foreigners were pushing crap all over an all American classic, yes I'm talking about Scramblers!!

Just kidding Vaughn

Actually let's twist the original question a little bit. Now it reads: Which vehicle is the most capable 4x4 right out of the box with the fewest modifications needed to make it trailworthy? (Let's leave out 'big' rigs like Mog's for this discussion).

1) No one will argue the most capable is the Rubicon Wrangler. Even without a lift it performs very well. Unfortunately it's $30,000.
2) Any other Wrangler. Many bolt on parts available, very good even in stock configuration. Can be had cheaply. Downside....drivetrain isn't as good as the Rubicon.
3) International Scout. V8, Dana 44's, very strong drivetrain. Lift needed very badly, but other than that they should be #2 if it wasn't for one thing: age. You could search for 20 years and not find one that will be very reliable/maintenance free.
4) Pre-IFS Toyota truck. For their weight their drivetrain is pretty good. Many parts available. Unless you get an 85 You'll have carb issues. Birfields will need some attention.
5) Cherokee's. Very good rig in many ways, lots of bolt on stuff for em, but drivetrain is a little weak (front and rear axles and ax5 trans to be specific).

I could go on but I think the top 5 is enough. Others up for consideration are CJ's, YJ's, and newer Toy's (Tacoma's).

The funny thing is every model has some flaws that make it less desirable. One rig has this but the other has this. And the next year of xxx rig has fuel injection but no longer has the superior suspension.....It's kind of a crap shoot. I guess you'd have to list each rig and then start adding up the cost of modifications until the rig is build to a certain point so they are all on a level playing field. Now that I would like to see!

EZ

 

[mbryson]

Originally posted by EZRhino
Too bad I didn't catch this thread earlier on when some bunch of dammed rice burning foreigners were pushing crap all over an all American classic, yes I'm talking about Scramblers!!

Just kidding Vaughn

Actually let's twist the original question a little bit. Now it reads: Which vehicle is the most capable 4x4 right out of the box with the fewest modifications needed to make it trailworthy? (Let's leave out 'big' rigs like Mog's for this discussion).

1) No one will argue the most capable is the Rubicon Wrangler. Even without a lift it performs very well. Unfortunately it's $30,000.
2) Any other Wrangler. Many bolt on parts available, very good even in stock configuration. Can be had cheaply. Downside....drivetrain isn't as good as the Rubicon.
3) International Scout. V8, Dana 44's, very strong drivetrain. Lift needed very badly, but other than that they should be #2 if it wasn't for one thing: age. You could search for 20 years and not find one that will be very reliable/maintenance free.
4) Pre-IFS Toyota truck. For their weight their drivetrain is pretty good. Many parts available. Unless you get an 85 You'll have carb issues. Birfields will need some attention.
5) Cherokee's. Very good rig in many ways, lots of bolt on stuff for em, but drivetrain is a little weak (front and rear axles and ax5 trans to be specific).

I could go on but I think the top 5 is enough. Others up for consideration are CJ's, YJ's, and newer Toy's (Tacoma's).

The funny thing is every model has some flaws that make it less desirable. One rig has this but the other has this. And the next year of xxx rig has fuel injection but no longer has the superior suspension.....It's kind of a crap shoot. I guess you'd have to list each rig and then start adding up the cost of modifications until the rig is build to a certain point so they are all on a level playing field. Now that I would like to see!

EZ

Hey, there's a Jeep in your avatar?!?!?!?!?

 

[Klif01]

In my oppinion I like my toyota. its a 94 and has ifs although I don't like it I have to have it untill I can afford the SAS. I am on a budget so one of the newer wranglers or toy's I can't afford. So far I have spent close to 200 dollars lifting it 6" different tires rims etc. I love the looks of the cherokee's and I would have gotten one if I didn't come across this truck. Its all a matter of oppinion. I strive to make my truck look good, yes im still a teen and I still try to pick up on women. But hey I don't think arguing over which is best is the issue. Im not going to not wheel with my friends just because they drive a jeep or whatever. I just want to have fun, and because I am on a budget I have to fab everything myself which is another fun part of this. If you are going to get a rig get somthing you like the looks of, and make sure you can upgrade it to whatever your heart desires.......

 

[tv_larsen]

Originally posted by EZRhino

1) No one will argue the most capable is the Rubicon Wrangler. Even without a lift it performs very well. Unfortunately it's $30,000.
2) Any other Wrangler. Many bolt on parts available, very good even in stock configuration. Can be had cheaply. Downside....drivetrain isn't as good as the Rubicon.
3) International Scout. V8, Dana 44's, very strong drivetrain. Lift needed very badly, but other than that they should be #2 if it wasn't for one thing: age. You could search for 20 years and not find one that will be very reliable/maintenance free.
4) Pre-IFS Toyota truck. For their weight their drivetrain is pretty good. Many parts available. Unless you get an 85 You'll have carb issues. Birfields will need some attention.
5) Cherokee's. Very good rig in many ways, lots of bolt on stuff for em, but drivetrain is a little weak (front and rear axles and ax5 trans to be specific).

If you're judging these rigs based solely on their "out of the box" capability, why do you even consider their aftermarket parts availability, cost, and age?

BTW, the early Bronco should be very high on that list.

I also think the H2 should be 2nd on the list, or does that fit the 'Mog catagory? LOL

 

[EZRhino]

Geez dude, did you even bother reading what I wrote? I said the closest thing to a trail rig requiring the fewest modifications possible. There is no such thing as a trail rig sitting down at the dealer; even the Rubicon needs a lift!! As for Mogs, again, I specifically said let's leave these out of the equation; they are in a world of their own. (Along with Pinzies and those barn-on-wheels Rover thingys).

I thought of some others on the way home:

87-91 full size Blazers. V8, good auto's, and they are 4 lifted leaf springs and a brain dead 14 bolt swap away from being ideal.

Late model Ram Chargers are similar. Early Bronco's are a good starting point as well. (No FI though).

EZ

 

[N-Smooth]

hmmmm...

i have comments about a few of the rigs mentioned. good and bad comments IMHO.

samurais: cheap to buy, cheap to build, light, but too short of a wheelbase and weak axles, have a frame, carb

xj's: not too cheap to buy, lots of parts available, light, good wheelbase, not so good axles, NO FRAME!, fuel injected

yj's: dime a dozen now, tons of parts available, goods wheelbase, not so good axles, have a frame, fuel injected

toys: not very cheap, cheap to build, pretty light, kinda long wheelbase, pretty good axles, have a frame, carb and fi

that is the basics of those four rigs. those are the ones i am particularly opinionated about that is why i picked them. personally i think that samurais and toyotas are built better than jeeps. i have a xj and i have friends with yj's and tj's. i also have a samurai and i have friends with yotas. and seriously, the jeeps seem to have more stupid problems than the foreigns. that might be based on drivers but i also drive the sami and it takes abuse well (trust me).

just trying to add to what you guys have already built. pretty long post so far.
why does everyone say the 2 cents thing?

just my 2 cents,
-nate

p.s damn 2 cents

 

[Hickey]

You want my 2 CENTS??? Well britney, the best damn rig that was ever concieved of....





























Is in your fawking garage!!! Now go grind on my brakes like TRD270 said to!!!! That will shut you ho's up!!










BRITNEY RULES!!!

 

[Hickey]

oh yeah, and a pic for you unlearned folk..

Scramblers and Zuks and Toys.... WHATEVER!!!