D60 swap in a Rubicon

[Caleb]

I'm getting the front axle from 53willys (his dad's black Cherokee is the donor), and he said it was 63". Looking up the part number for the shafts, I come up with the inners being 34.75 and 18.63 for about 54" from ball joint to ball joint. So I think 63" is pretty close with those measurements? No? This is kind of important, because I don't want to be 67 or more wide...

I also believe the FF rear axles are 34.94", from flange to end of the splines.

Not sure if those can help you determine the actual width of the axles....

Rear hubs aren't important to me. They might be nice to have for some reason, but I could see myself nailing one on rocks and breaking it. So I'll just stay with the flange style...

So the weld on ones are better to get than the BTF bolt on talked about earlier? I honestly don't have a preference either way...

As for the rear D60, I guess I'll keep looking then. That $300 included shipping... According to car-part.com, there isn't one up here for the taking.

I've never heard of a 63" HP44 (that's cool if it exists stock), especially from a Fullsize Truck, the same Fullsize truck that had a HP60 as an option (and I know that HP60 is about 67" WMS). The only one close to that is an EB which I believe is right around 60" WMS. I would get that measurement double checked.

 

[Zombie]

....Or is that what you meant, when you said 'have'?

hey.. I had to try, right?
Lemme see what I get back from taxes.
(I know.. I just gave the government and intrest free loan, but I like getting big chunks back... how else am I supposed to be able to get big mods past my wife? If its there every month, its money, but once a year, its free money!)

 

[waynehartwig]

hey.. I had to try, right?
Lemme see what I get back from taxes.
(I know.. I just gave the government and intrest free loan, but I like getting big chunks back... how else am I supposed to be able to get big mods past my wife? If its there every month, its money, but once a year, its free money!)

Exactly!!

 

[Andy]

If I were you I would just save up till you can swap some real D60's in. Your talking about alot of work and mods for something you already have in the front. And not to mention Ford D60 rear ends out of 70's trucks almost always have spun carrier bearings in the housings.

 

[waynehartwig]

I've never heard of a 63" HP44 (that's cool if it exists stock), especially from a Fullsize Truck, the same Fullsize truck that had a HP60 as an option (and I know that HP60 is about 67" WMS). The only one close to that is an EB which I believe is right around 60" WMS. I would get that measurement double checked.

That's not what I want to hear....

 

[Andy]

It's about 67"-68" wms to wms if I'm not mistaken.

 

[waynehartwig]

If I were you I would just save up till you can swap some real D60's in. Your talking about alot of work and mods for something you already have in the front. And not to mention Ford D60 rear ends out of 70's trucks almost always have spun carrier bearings in the housings.

What do you mean, real D60's? Doing this swap isn't because it's a low budget deal...

You don't think my reasoning for the HPD44 swap is sufficient of a reason? To me it is, be able to triangulate and have bigger breaks. Plus I keep the D44 clearance... This all sounds pretty good to me.

 

[bobdog]

Actually Wayne having owned trucks with those brakes I don't think they are all that great. The Ford calipers have a tendency to stop working evenly and I don't like the way they attach to the bracket either. I like the Chevy style with the slider bolts much better. I do think that the swap you are thinking about has advantages over the Ruby 44 though. Getting rid of the unit bearing and funky balljoint arangment seems worthwhile but as others have said it will be FULL width.

 

[notajeep]

FOOL width.

 

[I Lean]

Since you'll be redoing the rear axle anyway, it doesn't really matter what it comes out of....for your purposes, a rear 60 is a rear 60. Just about all of them will be around 65" wide, and 8 lug. A very few will have the spindle ID large enough to fit 35 spline shafts, but most will need boring. I'd be surprised if you couldn't find one at any pick 'n pull or similar. Lots of older Fords, and lots and lots of Dodges had 'em.

Bolt on disk brackets vs. weld-on....no preference here. I used weld-on ones cuz I had 'em available and they were cheap. If you're ordering some in, take your pick.

 

[Meat_]

Ummm... his current 44 is NOT as strong as the one he's talking about putting in.

Hey Wayne, if you are coming down here to get the front anyway... I have a D60 rear that I'll trade to you for waaay less than $300

 

[Andy]

That's exactly what I'm saying. Your not in my eyes gaining anything you don't already have. A D44 is a D44 and if your not to hard on stuff it will be fine. But the more capable you make your Jeep the more stress you put on your drivetrain, that's always what I have experienced and seen. Good luck, I just hate to see you spend your money twice and do the job twice.

 

[waynehartwig]

Ummm... his current 44 is NOT as strong as the one he's talking about putting in.

Hey Wayne, if you are coming down here to get the front anyway... I have a D60 rear that I'll trade to you for waaay less than $300

The D44 will be shipped to me from SLC....Otherwise I'd probably take it

Doesn't a D66 have the same mounting flange as a D44 knuckle? Meaning that if I wanted to I could put the same spindle out front and rear?

 

[waynehartwig]

That's exactly what I'm saying. Your not in my eyes gaining anything you don't already have. A D44 is a D44 and if your not to hard on stuff it will be fine. But the more capable you make your Jeep the more stress you put on your drivetrain, that's always what I have experienced and seen. Good luck, I just hate to see you spend your money twice and do the job twice.

I appreciate that. But I honestly don't think I *need* more than 44's front and rear. I have no intentions on going larger than 35" tires, and I already take it places I shouldn't - a lot of people can vouch for that. It's maiden voyage, with less than 1k miles and dealer plates on it, was the Rubicon. I take it places 'no one' else in a DD will go and really have no issues following buggies. Basically put, even if I had D60/14T front and rear, I still wouldn't drive it any different, nor would I go larger than 35" tires.

Oh, my Rubicon is also a LEASE! ..And the fact I need to drive it home, keeps me mellow. But if I do ever roll it, it's over - full width, full stretch, competition cut, flat/no fenders, 39" tires, etc. But I'm also thinking of dropping this down to 4.5" and using it on 'family' type trails and building something else for the 'fun' stuff that I'd really like to do.

But what I do dislike is the fact I can't stop very well. Even sliding down obstacles, I can not lock the tires up - and I'm putting some MEAN pressure on the pedal. AND my front suspension is something less desired - the whole trackbar/drag link angle is off, so I get bump steer (not bad, but it's there). Going through crevices or what not I get axle steer. My turning radius sucks becuase everything is hitting. Ball joints/hub bearings are a crappy way of doing things. With a manual hub setup I can disengage them while on the freeway. With the HP I can run the control arms under the driveline and triangulate the front end. I can fix all of the above if I wanted to - strip the axle and do a coil over and relocate some brackets - all problems solved. But the main reason for the swap is the HP to triangulate without doing something fancy to miss the motor. The rest of it is bonus and will be fixed on the install.

 

[Meat_]

...A D44 is a D44...

That's worse than saying that the D61 pile of CAD crap in the front of my Dodge is as good as a D60

 

[waynehartwig]

At this point, I think I'm going to keep on track with the HPD44 and narrow it to accept Waggy axles, Chevy 1/2 ton brakes and 5 on 5.5" bolt pattern and keep my rear D44 the way it is. ...Scrapping the whole D60 thing entirely...

 

[Meat_]

At this point, I think I'm going to keep on track with the HPD44 and narrow it to accept Waggy axles, Chevy 1/2 ton brakes and 5 on 5.5" bolt pattern and keep my rear D44 the way it is. ...Scrapping the whole D60 thing entirely...

Sigh

 

[waynehartwig]

Sigh

I honestly don't see a reason in replacing it, with my last reasons I mentioned. The only reason I was going to, was to go with larger brakes and keep the 8 lug thing going front and rear.

Now that I know (think) that HPD44 is actually full width and I have to narrow it anyway, I might as well do the 5 lug conversion on it and go play. With the rear D60, I would have to redo my rear suspension (or at least re do the bracketry on the axle), which I really have no interest in doing....

You've seen the places I take my Rubicon. You've been out wheeling with me before. The only time I have broken anything is when I had stock parts and 37" tires. I got smart quick and replaced the axles with 4340 and got rid of the 37's - no more problems. I do still have problems with my D30 balljoints and the chinsy uni bearings.... They don't like the 35's and I have to replace them about every 6 months because they start getting loose and mess up my steering pretty bad.

 

[waynehartwig]

The HPD44 that I was getting was sold to someone else. But I still think I'm going to do the D60 in the rear. I've just been thinking about it, and I'd really like the time in the shop, if nothing else

However, I think I want to stay 62" wide and possibly a HPD60?

I think I'll start a new thread, as I have more questions besides just a D60....

 

[Meat_]

You are skitso