The backpacking thread

[sixstringsteve]

yeah, he let me borrow some gear this past weekend. He's the man. I'm excited for him to get back and share some more of his geek knowledge with me. I wanted to go with him and film his trip, but I didn't have the funds.

 

[sixstringsteve]

Here's one I'd like to do this fall:

http://www.wasatchhiker.com/home/wasatch-trails/silver-creek-trail/

 

[Kevin B.]

Steve, are you going to be a gram weenie?

 

[DAA]

This summer has kinda sucked all around for me, as far as getting out and doing anything. Just been way too busy with way too much stuff. Only been backpacking twice this year, Grand Gulch back in April and then my Son and I did 3 nights/4 days in the Uintas (upper Rock creek) the last weekend in June. Sure wish I could have gotten out and done more backpacking, hopefully next year.

Couple pics from the Uintas last month.

We've been using a Steripen for water treatment in the mountains and I really like it a lot. For the canyons I've been using a filter though - a Sawyer Squeeze - the water in Grand Gulch, for instance, was so stained and had so much stuff floating around in it, I really felt better using a filter there.

I've been trying to lighten up too, but I'm too old and soft, I need my luxuries - double walled tent, real sleeping bag with a zipper, plenty of comfy clothes to wear, lots of good grub, JetBoil, lots of good whiskey etc. On the trip above, my starting pack weight was 26 lbs, including a quart of gatorade, camp shoes, pad just for sitting on, fishing kit, camera and a fifth of High West. I'd like to get lower, but I don't want to give anything up for it . Like I said, getting old and soft...

- DAA

 

[sixstringsteve]

Steve, are you going to be a gram weenie?

Good question. I already bought a scale... is that bad? I don't want to become OCD, but weight is definitely a factor to consider. I guess we'll see where I end up. I think lots of people get crazy about grams, and they're more interested in their pack weight than the actual trip they're going on. I hope to never be there. The book I have really stresses lightening your pack with free, or near-free stuff. That's the approach I'll be taking for now, though I will need a new sleeping bag if I'm going to continue down this path, and that definitely won't be free.

I do not want to compromise comfort or safety. If I can accomplish the task with a lighter item, I will. For example, i have a super slick esee izula knife that can be replaced with a (much lighter) razorblade. I can't chop down trees with my razorblade, but if I'm having to chop down trees to survive, I'm screwed anyway. Another example: I can buy some really cool titanium or aluminum utensils... or I could get some plastic ones that'll be lighter and way cheaper anyway. Lighter does not always equal more expensive, although it's a tough lesson to learn for me because I love spending money on camping gear. A nalgene bottles weigh 1/3 a pound. An empty soda bottle weighs 1/16 lb. And it's way cheaper. You get the point.


One thing this past week taught me is that there is a BIG difference between a 30 lb pack and an 18 lb pack. I'm not a fantastic hiker, so I need to carry less to keep up with others and not get totally exhausted. One cool thing my book talks about is that we all have our one or two heavy items that we simply won't give up. For me, that's my GoPro and my Nemo Fillo. The reason we count grams is so we can take these things along. I won't pay an extra $200 to save a few grams, but I will cut a pot in half to save weight if it's bigger than I need.

We've been using a Steripen for water treatment in the mountains and I really like it a lot. For the canyons I've been using a filter though - a Sawyer Squeeze - the water in Grand Gulch, for instance, was so stained and had so much stuff floating around in it, I really felt better using a filter there.

I've been trying to lighten up too, but I'm too old and soft, I need my luxuries - double walled tent, real sleeping bag with a zipper, plenty of comfy clothes to wear, lots of good grub, JetBoil, lots of good whiskey etc. On the trip above, my starting pack weight was 26 lbs, including a quart of gatorade, camp shoes, pad just for sitting on, fishing kit, camera and a fifth of High West. I'd like to get lower, but I don't want to give anything up for it . Like I said, getting old and soft...

- DAA

Wow, all that and it's only 26 lbs! It sounds like you've found a great balance. I'm not as manly as you Dave, so I need a lightweight pack for my delicate constitution.

 

[sixstringsteve]

More cheap, light(ish) ideas:

[video=youtube;62BtVoQYDlI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62BtVoQYDlI[/video]

[video=youtube;J5hIxjxlqdo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J5hIxjxlqdo[/video]

[video=youtube;ad9N2LxYpXU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ad9N2LxYpXU[/video]

 

[SnwMnkys]

Just got home from a vacation to Montana and Canada. Spent two days pseudo backpacking in Glacier Park. The original plan was 3 days, but the snow melt didnt cooperate with our plans and some of the trails that we wanted to take to the designated campgrounds were closed. It really wasnt even camping since we stayed at Granite Park Chalet. The second night was intended to be real camping elsewhere in the park.

Started at The Loop trailhead. It was 4 miles long with a little over 2000 ft elevation gain to the Chalet.

Destination in the background

What she though of hiking uphill with a pack.

Spent the evening at the Chalet. Definately worth just hiking too if you are ever in the area. You can take the Highline trail from Logans Pass which is pretty flat but its almost twice as long. But it was closed due to snow still being on the trail. Someone died on it earlier in the week trying to cross the snow.

The hike out was via the Swiftcurrent pass trail which was 8 miles long with a 2000 ft elevation loss. Most of that loss being in the first 3 or 4 miles. It was definately the most scenic and the most fun. Snow patches and streams to cross, walking along cliff ledges and across makeshift bridges. This trail takes you to Many Glacier campground.

Grinnell glacier in the background. There is a trail from Granite Park chalet that breaks off the Highline trail to an overlook that has you looking down on the glacier and a lake from the peak.

Our destination was the beginning of the end lake in the background.

 

[thefirstzukman]

Has anyone taken their dog hiking with them? I bought a pack for my red healer and loaded it with a couple water bottles, 200 rounds of .22 and 2 30 round mags. I built me a very custom 10/22 that weighs 3lb 6oz with a red dot for hiking. I took my dog for a test hike and all was going well, he is a very energetic 5 yer old. Everything was going perfect and I think I could ad a couple more pounds to his pack but when it came time to go down hill he didn't like the idea and it took everything I had to get him off the mountain. I also don't know what to do with him at night. I really like the idea of taking him with me on multi day trips, I hope I can find a way to make it work.

 

[Unimog]

Heading out to do the Teton crest backwards next week (Jenny lake to the top of Teton village tram) with a bunch of older boys.

I keep lightening more and more as I get older. It just makes it so much easier to enjoy! This year, I've added a super light pad and 20 degree quilt. Tested them out during the winter out snowshoeing and camping in the yard, so I know they will do the job.

 

[sixstringsteve]

Unimog, which pand and quilt are you using? I'm in the market for a 20* quilt and I can't decide on what I want. The zpacks bag is very tempting. Do you get sweaty with your body being directly on the pad?

 

[sixstringsteve]

Has anyone taken their dog hiking with them? I bought a pack for my red healer and loaded it with a couple water bottles, 200 rounds of .22 and 2 30 round mags. I built me a very custom 10/22 that weighs 3lb 6oz with a red dot for hiking. I took my dog for a test hike and all was going well, he is a very energetic 5 yer old. Everything was going perfect and I think I could ad a couple more pounds to his pack but when it came time to go down hill he didn't like the idea and it took everything I had to get him off the mountain. I also don't know what to do with him at night. I really like the idea of taking him with me on multi day trips, I hope I can find a way to make it work.

I take Fender with me every time, but I don't load him up with 200 rounds. We're working on adapting his harness into a pack for him that will allow him to carry his own food and water. Maybe it was too new of an experience for your dog. Was this his first time hiking? His first time first time wearing a pack? His first time wearing a HEAVY pack? Do you think it was the pack weight that kept him from wanting to go downhill, or would he have been that way even without a pack? You're smart for taking him on a test hike. I think a few more test hikes should help. Maybe do a few without the pack on, then one with an empty pack, then slowly up the weight in the pack. He probably felt like the weight of the pack was dragging him downhill faster than he'd felt before and it made him nervous. That's my theory at least.

i don't need a rifle when I go camping, I just carry bear spray and a pocket gun if I'm really worried.

I think the key is to take him out more and more until he gets used to it (just like humans). The first few times I took Fender camping, he didn't sleep at all. He stayed alert all night watching all the interesting things around us, and keeping alert to protect us. After about 4 trips or so, he started to get used to the idea of sleeping in a tent, and he would actually put himself to bed a few hours before we did. He did better with tents that block his vision of the outside, otherwise it was stimulus overload.

I've tried sleeping under the stars with him, and he does pretty well, but will still go exploring in the middle of the night. I need to practice this with him more.

 

[Kevin B.]

Let's talk bear spray. I've never backpacked in bear country, where do you keep it? I knew a guy that carried fishing line with bells on it to hang around his tent, anybody feel that's necessary?

 

[sixstringsteve]

The only bear country I've camped in has been black bear country. I'm too scared to camp where brown, grizly, or polar bears live. I think it's important to remember that we hiked all our gear up to be in their home. If a bear came into my house to sleep the night, I'd make sure it left. Fortunately, black bears are more considerate than we are.

AF Canyon, the Rubicon, Yosemite, the Sierra Nevadas, Uintas, Payson Lakes, are all black bear country. Fortunately, black bears are, for the most part, not interested in humans at all. They eat berries and small animals, not humans. If they hear your voice, they run away. We saw one about 100 feet away at Dutchman Flat a few years back, and we walked towards it to get a better look, and it took off running. A lot of hikers tie bells around their pack so bears can hear them coming, and the bears will scamper away. You can also talk while hiking so they can hear your voice. If they hear your voice, they'll usually flee the area.

I don't know how bells on a tent would help.

Since bears aren't just lurking in the woods, waiting to attack me, I don't keep bear spray on my person. My wife does though. She puts it in the side pocket of her pack. If she gets worried that there might be animals nearby, she'll take it out and carry it in her hand for a few minutes until she feels the threat is gone. It makes her feel safe, and that's important to me. When I'm sleeping, I have it right near my head, ready for instant action if I need it. Having a dog also really helps us feel safe, as he will alert us to any nearby camp intruder.

In my mind, Black Bear safety here in Utah really comes down to food. They don't want you, they just want your food. Keep a clean camp. Don't throw unwanted food in the fire, and don't spill it around camp. Prepare food away from the area where you'll be sleeping. Make sure you don't smell like bacon when you go to bed. Store food AWAY from your tent. Put it in a stuff sack and throw it up in a tree so they can't get it. Bears aren't the only critters interested in your food, so that's a good practice anyway. Even if you're leaving the campsite for the night, don't leave food around. Inevitably, there will be more campers in the area soon, and they won't appreciate you attracting bears to the area. In Yosemite, you could feed black bears out of your hand (you should never do this) because they're so accustomed to humans leaving food around. They've learned that if they come into campsites, they'll have easy access to food. If we can remove any enticing for a bear to come into our camp for food in the beginning, we won't have to deal with bears coming to camp expecting to be fed. They simply won't come.

I was pretty worried about bears and mountain lions on my trip to Lake Hardy, and I didn't sleep all night. We didn't bring enough paracord to hang a bear bag from a tree, so we set all our food out on a rock about 200' from camp. it was all still there in the morning, and we didn't see any evidence of animals, but it wasn't a good idea and I don't recommend it. We burned all our trash and food-prep materail about 200' away from camp so we didn't attract critters. Then again, maybe it was my snoring that kept them away.


Here are some more links to bear safety:

http://wildlife.utah.gov/dwr/learn-more/bear-safety.html

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/fsem_035131.pdf

http://www.fs.usda.gov/detail/uwcnf/learning/safety-ethics/?cid=STELPRDB5085986

 

[sixstringsteve]

cool black bear facts:

- Black bears can live 30 years or more, but almost all are killed by people before reaching half that age.

- Black bears require large expanses of forest to live without conflicts with people. As forests are lost to human development, black bears and other wide-ranging species disappear.

- Food is usually too scarce for bears to live in groups. Females defend territories 2 to 6 miles in diameter. Males use larger, overlapping areas.

- The 500,000 black bears of North America kill fewer than one person per 3 years, on the average, despite hundreds of thousands of encounters. To put this in perspective, for each death from a black bear across North America, there are approximately 17 deaths from spiders, 25 deaths from snakes, 67 deaths from dogs, 150 deaths from tornadoes, 180 deaths from bees and wasps, 374 deaths from lightning, and 90,000 homicides in the United States alone (data from the National Center for Health Statistics, 1980-1983). In the rare event of one of these attacks, the best defense is to fight with fists, feet, rocks, or anything at hand. Playing dead is usually not the best action with black bears.

 

[sixstringsteve]

what about rattlesnake safety? Obviously prevention is the most important part, but what do you do if you get bitten? Is there any post-bite first aid? I heard the "extractor" didn't work. I worry all the time about my dog getting bitten and dying on the trail.

 

[DAA]

I've never backpacked anywhere that I was worried about bears, so I've never carried bear spray. But, if I ever did feel the need to carrry it, I'd carry it in a manner that it is instantly accessible 100% of the time. If you are ever going to need it, chances are you are only going to have seconds to figure that out and act. So not attached to and definitely not inside of my pack. Would have to look into the options for secure, quick draw holsters or put it on a lanyard or something, not sure exactly what is out there for it but I'm sure there are systems for carrying and maintaining full time instant access.

what about rattlesnake safety? Obviously prevention is the most important part, but what do you do if you get bitten?

First I'd try and bite that sum-B back and bite him GOOD. Then I'd seek medical attention. Which could be problematic...

- DAA

 

[sixstringsteve]

This cool video has some great tips on different ways to stake down tents and tarps.

[video=youtube;3eFAyKMz314]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3eFAyKMz314[/video]

 

[Rot Box]

Let's talk bear spray. I've never backpacked in bear country, where do you keep it? I knew a guy that carried fishing line with bells on it to hang around his tent, anybody feel that's necessary?

But, if I ever did feel the need to carrry it, I'd carry it in a manner that it is instantly accessible 100% of the time.

^ This. I've spent some time camping/backpacking in MT grizzly country and always carried it within a seconds reach. Is it likely to happen? who knows? doubtful I guess... But that sort of thing happens in an instant you do not want to be searching for it inside a pack by any means. Carrying a high caliber (and by high cal I mean minimum .45) pistol is not a bad idea either but that's another story.. Twice in Soda Butte MT (two years apart) there were Grizzly attacks within less than a mile of where I was camped and both were during the night. I never realized just how large a male grizzly was until I saw one pass through on the other side of the river where I was camped. I literally did not sleep that night lol.

I haven't worried too much about it in black bear country.

I like this thread. For awhile it was hard for me to get out and hike with my kids being so young. My girl turned 5 this year and loves hiking so I'm starting to get back into it. Good info you guy's

 

[sLcREX]

Are black bears the ones that like honey?

 

[blznnp]

I have never seen a bear when out camping, we had to have bear canisters before, that was mandatory by the forest service. We did have part of our group see some when we were hiking out our last day of a weeklong, was a couple cubs so needless to say, they didn't stick around to see if the moma bear would show up.