Why has your U4WDA membership expired?

[BroncoMama]

I'm still curious as to why the number 1 reason remains the people. I can understand those who answered as such not wanting to post up on here, but if you have that big of an issue with U4 that it's keeping the 10 bucks in your wallet, something needs to be said. Would it be an option to list all the board members on the U4 page here on RME with their user names or emails so that those with complaints could personally contact someone? I think it's highly unlikely that most people have complaints with everyone on the board, so if given the option of contacting someone personally, maybe more would speak up.

Here's another very uncomfortable thought though, is that actually a real reason or are those people just to damn stingy and think that is the best answer because it makes them feel like less of an ass? It's always so much easier to push the blame onto someone else. Just thinking out loud.

 

[Bear T]

^^^^
You're awesome.

I am willing to field any complaints against any U4WDA Board Members. I was a Vice President for the past 2 years, and am now serving in other positions. I would be more than happy to privately and confidentially discuss any issues with any person.

You can contact me by either PM or email, bear@dirthedz.com

I promise complete confidentiality. I just want to see our love of ohv travel protected as best as possible.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

...I just want to see our love of ohv travel protected as best as possible.

As does anyone, but I think you will find a clear fraction of current or past members that are confused as to what U4WDA is actually accomplishing on the ground towards protecting land access.

The end goal is no secret, and the paths to get there are no secret either. The method of the madness however :-\

Education: Any progress here? Anything on the books now? We are are at the height of the summer outdoor season. Who is there to educate if not our state Association? How many current BOD members are Trail Patrol or Tread Lightly certified? How many are active on their Trail Patrol hours and Tread Trainer certs? IMO opinion it should be 80% minimum, 100% the goal. Instead you have 1 or 2 out of 20 active in education. For reals, do a poll and report back, its speaks volumes about the Association imo. A BOD should have some formal training to protect out public lands, eating cookies in a board meeting once a month isn't doing the trick

Stewardship: Any progress here? Service projects planned? So for 2009 we've piggy-backed on another Associations (UTMA) service project. Is U4 planning anything? I'm not asking what member clubs are doing, I'm asking whats being done by the Association for the benefit of and for the Association. What dates can be put on our calendars?

Pro-Active Interaction: While 6 of the states BLM RMP's are behind us. We have 5 more in the pipeline, not to mention dozens of upcoming Forest, State and BLM revisions in the works. Who and what is being worked on? This should be the #1 priority of the U4WDA, simply put. Those 6 RMP's had 10x more outcome on the future of recreation on public lands than the last 20 years of service projects, newsletters, conventions and rides, yet the effort and manpower exerted past and present can be summarized by one or two BOD members working on these issues at an Association level, if that?

Clubs and individual groups of OHV recreators are in for a very big surprise when they find out their next club event could be required to have to have a Special Recreation Permit, a process that takes up to 180 days and an insurance premium to get. Yes, even a non-profit club just out to have a great day on the trail can required to get an SRP of face a fine. What is the U4WDA doing to work with BLM offices to clarify these permits on behalf of their clubs? Behind the actual trail closures and restrictions this was the next biggest issue the RMP's addressed. Even a planned RME run to Rattlesnake could be forced to file for an SRP, completely foreseeable.

The ratio between "hours on the ground" and "hours in the board room" has always been grossly skewed, management of any sizable group will eat up available resources though financial, membership and operations management, but the numbers have seemingly become disgustingly reduced in the past year? I was told less than 5 minutes was dedicated to anything remotely land use at that last BOD meeting, and that was discussing the UTMA event? True? That is pitiful if true.

I think the U4WDA needs a major BOD overhaul, not saying people need to leave, just restructure and clarify duties, responsibilities and expectations. A re-focus if you will. Things have been down a wayward path for quite some time, unfortunately it seems its to the point a simple turn won't get it back on track, too many hurt feelings, lost opportunities and damaged egos. If a BOD member can't tow their line, they need to be willing to step down and take a back seat position and let someone do the job as needed. If those fundamental jobs can't be done, other less crucial items need to be scaled back until the manpower can be mustered to satisfy the rear needs and goals. Speaking of goals, what are the goals of the U4WDA? Who is working on which aspect of said goals? What stage of completion are they?

Some may find my comments critical, so be it, they are. If anyone has faced the flip side of these issues it is myself and while I've seen the U4WDA in various stages of disarray in my years of involvement, I've never seen it in the apparent mess it is in to this day at the same time having the most BOD members too? How it got to that point we can all speculate but the fact remains I think the last thing U4WDA needs to worry about is roping in new and renewing members until they can get a game plan beyond next week. If said game plan does exist, lets here it! The easiest way to sell a potential member on the organization is to show them results and plans, using the blanket statement "all money goes to keeping public lands public" may be a great one liner at a fundraiser, but its neither factual nor possible.

NPLD is in 4 months, I've heard absolutely nothing about it on club levels? This in the past years has been U4WDA's only official stewardship showing? Will it be a last minute hobble this year or are plans in the work under the leadership of an event coordinator?

 

[Bear T]

As always Kurt, you're right. I wish you weren't but you are.

 

[Skylinerider]

Great questions Kurt, definately questions that, as a member of U4, I would like to know the answers to.
Heck, I would like to know who is actually on the BOD, and what they do. I can find a few on U4's site, but I know there are more than are listed on there.

 

[CJ Matt]

Questions for those that have this view:
I am not satisfied with leadership or management.

Are you letting your personal feeling keep you from being a member of a group that does a lot of good?

Are you letting a couple of issues or decisions make your decision rather than looking at the big picture?

I am not sure if I have met any of the U4WDA officials or not but would not let a dislike of an individual take away from the group. The membership fee of $10 is very little and can help you be able to keep trails and areas open that could otherwise be in jeopardy. Like or dislike some of the members and like or dislike some of what may be going on I doubt any of you would say that the U4WDA is all bad.

 

[Mug]

I appreciate everyone's time who has put some input on the thread and for voting in the poll. I regret, to some degree, putting an "Other" option. We may never know why some have left the association... If you did vote the "Other" box, please do your best to explain in the thread. And by all means, keep voting and commenting!

Illuminating, to say the least.

I will be following up AS AN INDIVIDUAL AND BUSINESS MEMBER at the meetings with the BOD and bring up some of the discusion that is posted here. And for those of you who don't know who is on the Board, many of them are reading this thread daily, and most are actively commenting: (Bear, The Big Sgt, etc.)

If it's not perfectly clear already - NO ONE of you will go unheard if you make the effort to participate and communicate with U4WDA. You can do that even if you live in Etna, or work 70 hours a week, or drive a Subaru wagon that you call a 4x4.

 

[TheBigSgt]

ANyone that wants to can contact me, please in the evening before 9 and I will give straight up answers.

 

[SAMI]

I doubt anyone's going to make a personall phone call and ask what is going on, or tell you what they think about this and that. I do think that Kurt has made some great points that haven't quite been answered. Who is U4 of 2009? Who is the U4 BOD of 2009? Maybe some literature can be produced in the Compass, or a bio on the u4wda web page. I don't know. But I do believe that alot of what Kurt said is very true, and hard to swallow if you've been involved in the past.

I'm not saying any of this to bash on the org or its BOD. I believe that Kurt really nailed so many points down, and none have been addressed. Granted, alot might not have easy answers until solutions are devised and carried out. A few new minds on teh BOD and a reorganization of it's structure could go a long way. Who knows until something is done.

To reiterate some great points of concern made by Kurt..

Education: Any progress here? Anything on the books now?

Stewardship: Any progress here? Is U4 planning anything?... I'm asking whats being done by the Association for the benefit of and for the Association. What dates can be put on our calendars?

Pro-Active Interaction: RMP's This should be the #1 priority of the U4WDA, simply put.

I was told less than 5 minutes was dedicated to anything remotely land use at that last BOD meeting, and that was discussing the UTMA event? True? That is pitiful if true.

I think the U4WDA needs a major BOD overhaul, not saying people need to leave, just restructure and clarify duties, responsibilities and expectations. A re-focus if you will... If those fundamental jobs can't be done, other less crucial items need to be scaled back until the manpower can be mustered to satisfy the rear needs and goals. Speaking of goals, what are the goals of the U4WDA? Who is working on which aspect of said goals? What stage of completion are they?

I think the last thing U4WDA needs to worry about is roping in new and renewing members until they can get a game plan beyond next week... using the blanket statement "all money goes to keeping public lands public" may be a great one liner at a fundraiser, but its neither factual nor possible.

 

[Rodeoman]

Iread through a whole thread. I think Kurt has presented some real good questions in there. I know for instance that our club Zutah Wheelers had a 100% U4WDA membership last year. However this year I do not intend to do it myself. Can't speak for the rest, but I just can't get over the fact, that the whole thing is very poorly run. I remember couple years ago - participated in Forrest Lake cleanup, by the time we got back down everyone had left, so it was up to us to figure out what to do with garbage we took out. Participated in another trail repair at Forrest Lake trail last summer, granted it was put on by Utah4X4 club... Wasn't impressed with the turnout and it seemed more folks came to chat instead of get their hands dirty. Compass magazine was another big dissapointment as well. Only received 2... Articles weren't all that informative, I did appreciate trail map info. So when it comes to me, it isn't about money, but it is a principle. Plus I do not think we are well represented aka U4WDA doesn't have as much pull as it once did. Prove me wrong and I will happily donate some of my own time for trail repairs and some $$$ towards memberships and such. I am sure a lot of others will follow. Thanks for reading.

 

[Mug]

ANyone that wants to can contact me, please in the evening before 9 and I will give straight up answers.

By PM? Or do you have a phone number?

A few new minds on teh BOD and a reorganization of it's structure could go a long way. Who knows until something is done..

Sami, when can you start?

Didn't your english teacher tell you "alot" is not a word.

I do not intend to do it myself. Can't speak for the rest, but I just can't get over the fact, that the whole thing is very poorly run. I remember couple years ago - participated in Forrest Lake cleanup, by the time we got back down everyone had left, so it was up to us to figure out what to do with garbage we took out. Participated in another trail repair at Forrest Lake trail last summer, granted it was put on by Utah4X4 club... Wasn't impressed with the turnout and it seemed more folks came to chat instead of get their hands dirty. Compass magazine was another big dissapointment as well. Only received 2... Articles weren't all that informative, I did appreciate trail map info. So when it comes to me, it isn't about money, but it is a principle. Plus I do not think we are well represented aka U4WDA doesn't have as much pull as it once did. Prove me wrong and I will happily donate some of my own time for trail repairs and some $$$ towards memberships and such. I am sure a lot of others will follow. Thanks for reading.

Thank you for the comments, Rodeoman. (Standing on soapbox now) This is not a turn key, show up when and where you want kind of a thing. The organization is ONLY as big, or involved, or active AS IT'S MEMBERS ARE. By saying that U4WDA did not move you while you were a member, is only to say that you didn't move yourself! U4 evaporates tomorrow if nobody shows up! We make the association, not the other way around!! : pullinghairout :

 

[TheBigSgt]

801-201-6778

 

[Bear T]

Sami has spent the last few years working with the U4. He is a great volunteer.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

Questions for those that have this view:
I am not satisfied with leadership or management.

Are you letting your personal feeling keep you from being a member of a group that does a lot of good?

Are you letting a couple of issues or decisions make your decision rather than looking at the big picture...

I don't have any ill will with the current BOD from a personal standpoint, in fact most of them have been and are close friends of mine over the years. However my dis-satisfaction with the management stems from the lack of game plan, action and results, not the single actions of one, the actions of the BOD in general. I think there are others with similar feelings voting that way too, again not a personal dis-satisfaction with any one or more persons, rather a dis-satisfaction with the entire direction the U4WDA is going. I've outlined my issues in what I feel is a very clear manner. A day later and we still have absolutely zero response to them. It shouldn't take but an hour for any active BOD member to answer these if the answers existed. The fact is there is no education plan under way, there is no service projects in the planning, and there is zero being done on behalf of the U4WDA on any of the RMP's (there are outside affiliates working on these RMP's thankfully). Prove me wrong, I would absolutely love to be proven wrong here. Please tell me its not already June and there is nothing in the pipeline for the entire summer and you are yet to appoint anyone to be in charge of the NPLD projects that should have been in the works several months ago.

I co-authored their bylaws, I know what they have to do with their money if the thing implodes... they are on shaky grounds and really need to get their **** together if they want to have any sort of membership base in the coming year. Its a giant domino effect. Lose members -> Lose Budget & Volunteers. Lose Budget -> Lost pages out of the Compass and ability to fund any sort of Land Use projects. -> Lose the Compass and the activity on the ground and you lose members. A revolving domino effect if you will.

I've been there in what I feel were U4WDA's darkest moments as far as membership, budget and activity, yet all don't seem to hold a candle to the situation they apparently have on their hands now. I have nothing to gain by U4WDA running into the ground, in fact I stand to lose. I've literally donated thousands of hours to the U4 over the past years, do you think it makes me sleep better knowing they are on the fritz over ego's, sensitive souls and apparent lack of control from all angles. Absolutely not, it makes me sick. I'm sure there are other past BOD members & officers that feel the same.

I've offered my opinions, now I'll offer my suggestions...

1. Reorganize the BOD. Verify any and all BOD members are actually active and intersted in participating on a higher level. This includes lining each and every one of them to become a Trail Patrol member and Tread Lightly Trainer. Each should be required to meet their minimum Trail Patrol hours and participate in Tread Lightly training classes. This can be done from all over the state and absolutely does not require monthly BOD meeting attendance, yet is far more important imo than any of the current functions.

2. Require each and ever BOD member to orchastrate and plan some sort of education, stewardship or land use project. Every single one. It is absolutely ridiculous to have a single "Land Use Officer" (is that position even filled??). This could be tied into #1. Joe Shmoe could plan a Trail Patrol class for his/her or a random club. Freddy Reddy could plan a service project at the Bountiful B. Suzy Quzy could host a Tread Lightly class for an open invite of forums, clubs, etc.

3. Round file conventions and rides unless a member club wants to handle them 100%, part of this is ensuring that already crucial BOD manpower doesn't get wasted planning a fun ride that does little/nothing to actually protect access. If/when things smooth out, they can be looked at.

4. Revise the Compass mission. Trip reports are fabulous, tech is great too. But we are not competing with the general rags, we are an advocay group that is trying to keep public lands public. Content should be 50-50, land use oriented verus everything else. For every trip report or tech article there should be a land use article (service project report, etc).

5. Land manager interaction. Re-instate the calling tree. Each active BOD member should be in charge of 5 phonecalls 6 times a year. They call individual FS/BLM/NPS offices and let them know we are here to help, here to prevent closures and here to ensure that no closures go un-noticed. In talking with them you stay up to date with their needs and any changes expected on thier beat, aka motorized travel revisions, RMP's, SRP stipulations, etc.

I could go on for hours... but you'll see the points I am emphasizing. Land use, land use, land use. This IS what the U4WDA should be. Not a club, not an event organizer, not a social group, an advocacy group working in proactive means to keep 4x4 routes open throughout the state. Let clubs be clubs and plan fun rides and localized service projects. Let Usa-All and BRC handle litigation & lobbying and let Petersons handle tech writeups and trail reports. Be a state Association representing the true needs of 4x4 users... that need is trails to recreate on in 1, 5 and 50 years.

 

[SAMI]

When can I start? I'm still planning and carrying on, just not in the name of anything U4WDA. Don't get me wrong, I hope that U4 can bounce back since it's name is becoming recognizable. The situation really does require a hard look at what is really important for the BOD to be pursuing in the best interest of the statewide access, and it's very own members and finacial supporters.

P.H.O.R. we met at the Delta Crawl on course #7. I was the guy in a green vest with a camera, Jason. I like you, you've got some vigor. I'd love to see you, with your go-gettum attitude, be instrumental in straightening out the issues that have been outlined.

I do want to add that while I believe U4 is in a crippled state right now, it has potential to bounce back. I hope it does. Also, just because an outdoor enthusiast is not actively involved with U4, that doesn't mean that they are contributing to the problem. Especially right now. U4 oughtta get straightend out before it goes fishing for volunteers. Things that Kurt has also brought up.

 

[Mug]

I remember - Hence the attempted humor. See you at the AJS?

 

[CJ Matt]

A lot of very good points and ideas. My membership is up this month and I will renew and hope that they can turn things around.

 

[SAMI]

I remember - Hence the attempted humor. See you at the AJS?

No worries! See you there

 

[GOAT]

However my dis-satisfaction with the management stems from the lack of game plan, action and results, not the single actions of one, the actions of the BOD in general. I think there are others with similar feelings .

Spot on.

We have been members since I moved here and have donated our time and efforts.

We attended a couple of meetings, and were pretty disappointed with what we observed, considering what I expected. People were staring at the ceiling, reading, and surfing the net. Other than the occasional jabs at one another, there was not much in the way if two way communication or the exchange of ideas. The meeting reminded me of my old local jeep club in san antonio rather than the established organization that it is/was.

Jenn volunteered to write several articles for the compass. Each time, it was a total PITA interviewing people who basically made no effort to contribute and treated it as an inconvenience. None of the members she wrote of once said thank you......including one of our close friends. At least the city weekly pays to publish her writing. She has thankfully washed her hands of it.


At times I am considered to be a pessimist when it comes to land use. I still believe it's time to start hitting up land owners for potential use of their property. It is only a matter of time.

My 2c

 

[Bear T]

All valid points, and I appreciate them.

Kurt, I wish I could give you answers, but as you know, I don't have them. Yet.

There are items being worked on. The changes, if they come, will not be overnight. I ask for the same thing that Kurt and Steve, and countless of other lost volunteers have asked for, patience and help.

Patience to give us the chance to fix the problems. Which I know is asking a lot, how many chances should we get? I don't know.

Help, if projects are put together, and announced, show up and do your part.

I know the U4 has lost the respect of a lot of members and former members... I am trying to do my part to get that respect back. I will be more than happy to keep people up to date with any happenings in the U4WDA.