Haters

[rholbrook]

I think its time to find out who the haters of our motorized outdoor recreations are, especially in Moab. I refuse to give my money to these businesses that benefit financially from us when they openly fight against the people who put money in their pockets. Can we call them out here, get a list put together and then post this list on the various other forums so that we don't support them?

 

[Caleb]

This has been done before and IIRC it created a lot of controversy. A lot of the companies that were "openly" supporting SUWA and similar groups, didn't really know what they were supporting. The list ended up being thrown out. I bet if you search for blacklist on here you will find it.

 

[Caleb]

Here is a thread about the deletion of said list and why it was done.

 

[Vonski]

Here is a thread about the deletion of said list and why it was done.

Could one say that if a business owner in Moab isn't proactive enough to make an attempt to distinguish themselves from a SUWA supporter/contibutor, then they may as well be part of the problem?

You know the saying... "If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem".

If there is any question, any resident or Moab native could pretty effectively pick 'em out.

Any Moab people on RME want to enlighten us on the list and give their feedback?

 

[Caleb]

It was kind of mentioned in the other thread, but I think a better approach is rather than a list of companies to boycott, come up with a list of companies to support. I think it would be a lot more rewarding to those companies that choose to support us to be on the good list. Than to not be on a list of any type. I think it would accomplish the same thing, giving your money to the companies that help keep our hobbies around.

 

[Vonski]

It was kind of mentioned in the other thread, but I think a better approach is rather than a list of companies to boycott, come up with a list of companies to support. I think it would be a lot more rewarding to those companies that choose to support us to be on the good list. Than to not be on a list of any type. I think it would accomplish the same thing, giving your money to the companies that help keep our hobbies around.

So, an updated list needs to be created then, yes? Is anyone currently working on such a thing?

 

[Bart]

I support someone working on this thread.

 

[Vonski]

I support Bart in supporting someone working on this thread.

 

[Herzog]

I'd also like to see a list of those business who do actively support us, I'd make sure to use their services and buy their products first while in town.

 

[Caleb]

Are we looking for a Moab list or a list for all over? I'll put a domain together that has a form on it allowing people to submit businesses.

 

[BroncoMama]

I would love a list as to whom we should support. I know for sure that the Sleep Inn is very rock crawler friendly. We've stayed there for years and have never been heckled about our trailer. Plus, Chris has dropped Lemon Joy's transfer case and fixed it in their parking lot. After sprinkling kitty litter on the puddle of gear oil, we went to the manager and apologized for our mess. He said don't even worry about it; he just appreciated us cleaning it up.

So there is one business for you! If Caleb made some kind of form, I'd be more than willing to make some calls and do some investigating.

 

[Caleb]

So I registered www.ohvfriendlymoab.com and www.ohvfriendlystops.com. I'll work on getting a form up this weekend.

EDIT: I also have www.ohvfriendly.com all three go to the same site right now.

 

[Mug]

thanks

 

[SSII]

Here is a thread about the deletion of said list and why it was done.

Okay, I understand why you did that, but I will be in Moab next week. I don't agree with not having a list.

If you don't want a blacklist, go the other way with it.

I think there should be a list that is released with businesses that are investigated and are proven to be OHV sympathetic. I will be extremely and VERY upset if I spend money at a business in Moab that supports SUWA. I have been going to Moab since 1993 and I ONLY want to support the OHV friendly retailers. That is all I want. To support those that support us.

I am done being passive and writing letters, emails and phone calls. I feel that we are being played by both parties of the OHV issue. I do know, that being friendly, accommodating and nice is perceived as a sign of weakness. The OHV community does come across as being weak. We NEED and MUST be firm and forceful. This is a war we ARE losing. It is time to step it up.

 

[Caleb]

Okay, I understand why you did that, but I will be in Moab next week. I don't agree with not having a list.

If you don't want a blacklist, go the other way with it.

I think there should be a list that is released with businesses that are investigated and are proven to be OHV sympathetic. I will be extremely and VERY upset if I spend money at a business in Moab that supports SUWA. I have been going to Moab since 1993 and I ONLY want to support the OHV friendly retailers. That is all I want. To support those that support us.

I am done being passive and writing letters, emails and phone calls. I feel that we are being played by both parties of the OHV issue. I do know, that being friendly, accommodating and nice is perceived as a sign of weakness. The OHV community does come across as being weak. We NEED and MUST be firm and forceful. This is a war we ARE losing. It is time to step it up.

First off, "I" didn't do anything. Second, I don't think the proper approach is to bash businesses. I think the proper approach is to reward businesses.

 

[Grim]

i don't think the proper approach is to bash businesses. I think the proper approach is to reward businesses.

x2

 

[rholbrook]

I also will reward businesses that support OHV. I go to Moab an average of 5 times a year. Each time I am laying down some hard earned coin and I refuse to give it to those who don't want me there. I want to support those in all areas, not just Moab. I go to Farmington, NM every year to flyfish, I would support those in NM as well. Lets get a list together.

 

[Vonski]

Second, I don't think the proper approach is to bash businesses. I think the proper approach is to reward businesses.

It may be helpful to define "bashing", so everyone is one the same page...

If an accurate list of SUWA (and other anti land use organizations) supporting businesses is generated, and I choose not to be a patron of these businesses, am I really "bashing" them? Is the generator of the list really "bashing" them? We would not be trying to engage in debate or confront them, we would simply take our business elsewhere.

If a business owner has strong enough feelings about their personal agenda or political views, they run the risk of potential backlash. Those are the risks, plain and simple.

I am in favor of a list of pro-ORV establishments, and I understand that this would be taking the "high-road". However, whats the big deal in creating a "black list"? Is there a reason we can't do both? If there was an accurate "black list", each and every one of you would want a copy, am i right? :stirring pot:

 

[utahluge]

I don't see whats so wrong about a blacklist. What about the bbb? They have their 'blacklist' so to speak. I am all for a whitelist.

The only downfall I see to a blacklist is that of competitors. If company A really hates/competes/etc. company B, they could easily bash company A. With a whitelist, its kind of hard for company A to bash company B.

If a company really does some good for me, I want to support them.

+1 for a whitelist

 

[Caleb]

It may be helpful to define "bashing", so everyone is one the same page...

If an accurate list of SUWA (and other anti land use organizations) supporting businesses is generated, and I choose not to be a patron of these businesses, am I really "bashing" them? Is the generator of the list really "bashing" them? We would not be trying to engage in debate or confront them, we would simply take our business elsewhere.

If a business owner has strong enough feelings about their personal agenda or political views, they run the risk of potential backlash. Those are the risks, plain and simple.

I am in favor of a list of pro-ORV establishments, and I understand that this would be taking the "high-road". However, whats the big deal in creating a "black list"? Is there a reason we can't do both? If there was an accurate "black list", each and every one of you would want a copy, am i right? :stirring pot:

I agree with you, but it's going to be tough to get an accurate list. If you remember back to the first black list, those businesses were all taken directly from the SUWA letter, but were still not accurate.

Yes, it would be beneficial to have both, but I'd rather reward those businesses that upfront and openly support our hobbies rather than possibly alienate a business that is in favor of "protecting our lands". You know how SUWA twists words. The reward approach could also motivate businesses to become more upfront about their support (or not) of the OHV crowds.